Sure, why not.
fceaab03-c97b-11e5-8df7-04019cc0dc01
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02:17 - ArchiBoT: Done! 1 users have been banned till 15/03/5016 21:17:07!
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A certain user won't be happy to see you further develop this spyware tool!
LOL, I can't wait for his next thread!
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I have a question - people who consistently bypass this sgtool wall - cheaters - going to get permabanned from sgtools right - but they are CONSISTENTLY BYPASS sgtool right? Will they even care if they already ignore this? Shouldn't you permaban the leakers aswell?
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Gather enough of those interconnected leakers and eventually there is single left. So it's up to him to keep them fed...
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Point 1 - leakers are banned too. I won't spoil how that module works, but it's ArchiBoT analyzing many independent facts to find out who committed a leak, including SGT data, search engines, connections between people etc.
Point 2 - KnSYS didn't decide yet if he wants to make list of all people banned public or not, but I wouldn't be surprised if he released an userscript which will automatically blacklist all cheaters on SG for interested users. This is only a first step.
BTW, the more cheaters found, the more likely that ArchiBoT will find leaker and ban him as well. We already succeeded when organizing our La Cirno de Mayo event, and we can do it again.
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But soon you will go to the dark side
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Time to unblacklist an innocent person!
I still don't care, really, but if you're ever in the need of a spot for a real baddie, then yea...:D
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oh you too? At least I know why now, guess he doesn't like Germans haha xD
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Another point for permabanning leaker not entrant who didnt used sgtool - leaker can leak the link inside just for lulz, how do entrant supposed to know that he had to use sgtools page? He will be like - private giveaway, mmkay (permabanned).
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Creators usually put proper note in giveaways that they're SGT-protected.
Besides, if you're joining private giveaway of user A, linked to you by user B, then it's your own fault as invite only giveaways should NEVER be linked by ANYBODY but the creator.
And if your own friend tries to ban you out of SGT, then I'm afraid you need better friends :3.
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Look, if I change my nickname to JuasArchi and my avatar to cirno, join some random chat and drop there a link with your private giveaway - how do people have to know that they got link not from creator? I don't advocating cheaters, just thinking about possible issues.
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If people from chat don't bother with checking if user who just gave them link to SGT-protected giveaway is in fact a creator, e.g. by checking if his SG profile matches the giveaway creator, then it's their own fault, especially because I expect from people to put proper SGT notice, as stated in the OP. You can't click random links given by random people like nothing happens, this is exactly the same as clicking links to leaked invite only giveaways you can find somewhere - you don't know if the guy is creator either (and usually he's not). If you can't make sure that you're not breaking the rules of SGT, then I can't assure you that you won't get ban because of doing so, simple as that.
Besides, it would be me who would need to report those people, not you, as you'd leak my giveaway. People are not getting banned automatically, only creator of the giveaway can report them if he finds them in his own giveaways, and nobody else.
Another factor would be if you dropped links to your giveaways and reported those people here. At first seeing many invalid entries would result probably in banning them, but then they'd appeal in general thread, and after further reviewing their case you would get a perma ban instead, if they were able to prove what they're stating, or gather enough people/arguments to convince me. In best case and with strong arguments you would do that once, same as you'd prove to support that you sent a new guy on SG a game and he didn't activate it - it's word vs word. But if you did it again, it'd be suspicious enough to act accordingly.
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So, in the end, it's still word vs word. That's what I'm talking about. That's the weakest spot on sg, and that's would be the weakest spot on sgtools too. You are very good person to take all this responsibility. I wish you luck, you'll need it.
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Of course it is, nearly everything related to banning is more or less word vs word, because you can never be 100% sure that thing X happened, or that thing X for sure didn't happen. Exactly the same is happening in courts everyday, judge only decides what is more likely to happen, based on fixed set of data, and if likeness factor is big enough, or even "obvious" (in rare situations), then he agrees that the guy committed a crime.
Likewise here. If I see @LostSoulVL making 600 SGT-powered giveaways, and exactly one guy that did not pass the initial check, and that guy is unknown to me, or is suspicious (usually by number of independent silly factors, such as groups, friends, SG ratio, past infractions and more), then I'm more likely to trust @LostSoulVL and ban him, even if he did in fact lie to me.
On the other hand, if you're new user, you fall into those "suspicious factors", and you're trying to ban recognized user on SG, who is known of no infractions in the past, many SGT-powered giveaways and more, then of course, you'll need to provide really good evidence for me in order to trust you.
No banning system is perfect, the whole point of banning system is to ban only obvious or very likely cases, to avoid potential abuse and false-positives. I'm not the one who responds to ban appeals - KnSYS does. So even if somebody will get falsely banned, because of reason X, he can still write in general thread and get reviewed by KnSYS, not me, who may decide that user is indeed telling the truth.
If you're asking if system is 100% legit - no, it's not, it will never be, and I'm not even trying to make it so. But I can say that it's at least 95% legit, while most likely being around 99.5%. This is enough for most cases, the rest can appeal, and if they don't have a strong history of acting in suspicious way, most likely KnSYS will give them another chance, just for the sake of checking if he's telling the truth.
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This still have sense - because sgtools can be cheated by, for example, marking won giveaways as not received to achieve needed ratio. In this case permaban would help to keep cheater out. On the other hand, if giveaway is really leaked by someone - of course permabans would not help much.
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Any changes to received feedback are logged and my 2hus have real fun hunting for those people.
18:22 Emma Stoned: !rant
18:22 ArchiBoT: THE RANT IS ON!
User: http://www.steamgifts.com/user/<REDACTED>/giveaways/won
Games: Dwarfs!? | Caster | The Adventures of Tree
NotReceived: 2 -> 3
(Coming soon: !guilty & !innocent)
18:23 Emma Stoned: !innocentSo yeah, a thing like 2 -> 5 -> 2 is suspicious enough for !guilty. It's only a matter of RNG now when that user will pop up.
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Yet again, don't be so fast) For example, one of the games I won was revoked form my account. I marked it as not received. And then giveaway creator provided me another copy, and I marked it as received again. So, for your system, it would completely look like I cheated with ratio, while I'm not)
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That's what !innocent is for. Received feedback is a witch hunt, unless we're sure that the user is cheating (e.g. because he changes same 2-3 games multiple times to avoid being spotted), we don't issue a ban. For example, in above case user was innocent, because he stated in the giveaway that the key didn't work and he agrees on GA deletion.
The algorithm is prirotizing people that are more likely to cheat, and spotting obvious cases is easy. If somebody has rather "strange" received changes, and quite frequent, then it should be obvious for him, you, and me, that he's trying to cheat the system.
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what's the point of banning people that won't use sgtools?
they will keep using leaked links.
edit: oh well, already replied there -.-
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02:34 - ArchiBoT: Done! 2 users have been banned till 15/03/5016 21:34:31!
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This is really weird. I had a train with a single invalid entrant and now that I went to check I see another guy in there. And I'm positively sure of this because I checked every single winner and giveaway carefully before sending the gifts. On a second check he's no longer there. O.O
Are you sure there are no false positives with this tool? I mean the invalid entrant had a clean profile, met the requirements and could have seen the link to the SGTools check in every single giveaway description.
2d66d6e3-d0e7-11e5-83b1-04019cc0dc01
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Tool is based on invalid entries reported by SGT. If you believe that invalid entries are not working properly, you should report it in general thread.
02:48 - ArchiBoT: Done! 1 users have been banned till 15/03/5016 21:48:35!
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How are you guarding against malicious use of this?
I can see the sort of people that care about this sort of thing laying traps (leaking it themselves elsewhere, or editing/deleting a post) and justifying it with "they're leechers anyway."
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If any user abuses the tool by doing something like this, he will get ban instead.
The process is not automatic as I said, the ban is a result of me verifying that cheaters are indeed cheaters and not false positives.
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Mind explaining how you would be able to verify that, though?
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If I did, then users could use that information against me or my algorithms implemented in ArchiBoT.
So sorry, but I will not. I can only say that false positives are unlikely to happen, and any user trying to abuse the report for his own gains, such as banning innocent users, will get banned instead.
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This sounds like a cop out to me on both counts
I'd want to know that they've been reported as invalid by (at least) two unconnected giveaway creators.
You also cannot promise the latter since there are so many ways and means to target people, not only where it would be obvious.
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sounds like sg-police™ to me...
really not liking how sgtools is advancing.
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Police and judiciary.
....Or just plain lynch mob.
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SGTools has not changed the way of handling bans to people that report invalid users, since it's beginning.
The banning process is simple and handmade:
1- Someone reports invalid entries on his/her giveaway to me
2- I check them
3- Proceed to ban the infractors manually
The only "new" thing is that Archi can now help me issuing the bans, since I'm quite busy lately. So the old formula still applies, but first point can be me or Archi. Since SGT database and admin tools are only available to me, Archi must use an API to ban users, so that's why ArchiBot is envolved, just as the way of issuing the ban.
Why bans are necessary?
We could argue that just with invalid entry list it's enough, since you'll get a reroll from your giveaway if they happen to win. Problem is that people who uses leaked giveaways, will probably be able to pass some of the giveaways requirements, so not needing a leak for some of them, thing that makes them a valid entry.
Having him banned, makes the giveaway creator sure that nobody that used leaked giveaways urls on the past can win his/her giveaway.
Malicious Users
There has not been any malicious user in the past, but of course that can happen in the future. Usually liars get caught pretty fast in real live, even faster on the internet. That's why bans are open to discussion with those affected by contacting me personally.
ArchiBot does have some features to try to do relationships between accounts, since they got a huge leak on a past event that forced them to track down the leaker. As of today I never used that feature and I don't think I have access to it, and I don't plan to use it unless a serious case of malicious user happens, that I highly doubt seeing which part of the community uses regularly SGT.
In the case of doubts or suggestions you all can always contact me on SGT main thread or directly adding me to steam. I'm always open to ideas and suggestions, and I'll explain the reason behind every aspect of sgt if asked without a problem. Transparency is a key feature of SGT and it'll be in the future.
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I'm not here to promise anything. I'm here to accept reports and decide whether the case is valid and people should be banned, or not.
If you don't agree with the system, you should express your thoughts in general thread.
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And yeh this is 10/10, some guy creating sgtool giveaway, leaking this anonimously at another forum (^____^ look at me im not abuser will do it only once. Or twice :3.Or trice) Yea, at the forum of people he dont like, and then he gets 50 people permabanned. Cool?
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Yeah someone can just post on that Russian forum that everyone hates
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Yep, you are following my thoughts, but you can post it anonymously at ANY forum at steam forum aswell, just create the profile with name like ♦bigpenis69♦, noone will detect you.
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Creators usually put proper note in giveaways that they're SGT-protected.
Besides, if you're joining private giveaway of user A, linked to you by user B, then it's your own fault as invite only giveaways should NEVER be linked by ANYBODY but the creator.
And if your own friend tries to ban you out of SGT, then I'm afraid you need better friends :3.
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What if someone, for some unknown reason, creates a SGTools giveaway, then sends the giveaway link to some user they dislike/want to troll, and links the SGTools ID here, resulting in an unfair ban to the user who entered the giveaway through the giveaway link?
I know this is a bit of a stretch and unlikely to happen, but I'm just inspecting this feature from a different angle. :P
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Sgtools have been down for a while in these couple days so I've to provide links to those puzzle solver.
Therefore I have sgtools giveaways that combine with unauthorized and authorized invalid entries, how could I separate whitelist and report those unauthorized entries to you?
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If you have any valid entries which are reported as invalid (such as your friend joining giveaway by your permission), make sure to include that info so we won't ban innocent people accidentally.
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Simply, let those people know that SGT is back up and they should verify themselves there.
If you still need to exclude some of your invalid entries, just provide me full list of people that are on the list, but should not be banned.
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So, it looks like the giveawayID is the same for every car in the train, even if they have to be checked one at a time for invalid entries?
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Unless you have different cheaters in different giveaways, it's not required to report all of them.
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The first car of the train had Joe and Fred as invalid. But another car down the road had Mary. But the giveawayID is the same for every car in the train, so only Joe and Fred got perma-banned.
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In this case, you'll need to wait for KnSYS to either implement proper system for doing such checks, or banning that guy himself.
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Temporarily closing reports until we can add implementation for @trentjaspar, as I suppose more users will ask for that.
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Oh wow, I never noticed this. How cool. :)
I don't know if you re-ran my previous train, but if not, here it is again:
297e4f5f-d220-11e5-83b1-04019cc0dc01
Thank you! BTW, happy to report on my next 100-GA train, there weren't any invalid giveaways in any of the 98 cars. :)
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Opened again as we can now check train wagons as well.
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SGTools invalid entries report
Batch I:
6980dc2c-9b25-11e5-b2c0-0663045ed9e8
Batch II:
0508599e-d488-11e5-83b1-04019cc0dc01
1a510c7d-d488-11e5-83b1-04019cc0dc01
2ec135d6-d488-11e5-83b1-04019cc0dc01
4ac6861d-d488-11e5-83b1-04019cc0dc01
79e6c032-d487-11e5-83b1-04019cc0dc01
991e4073-d487-11e5-83b1-04019cc0dc01
b3e2c25b-d487-11e5-83b1-04019cc0dc01
d7295840-d487-11e5-83b1-04019cc0dc01
f0f37cca-d487-11e5-83b1-04019cc0dc01
Consent:
I am not acquainted with any of the invalid entry users, nor have I distributed the direct giveaway links by any means other than SGTools.
PlyrStar93
3/19/2016
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21:39 - ArchiBoT: Done! 1 users have been banned till 19/03/5016 16:39:36!
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Archi I have a question;
My SGTools protected train is now (for the moment) not showing any invalid entries on all of the 4 SGTools gates.
But I'm sure I had 1 invalid entry about a week ago (I saw the invalid entry myself) and that invalid entry is now about a week later vanished.
I only post the SGTools giveaway link in a main thread on the SG discussions, period.
I'm thinking it can be two things but please correct me if I'm wrong:
The person in question removed his entry and did go this time through the SGTools gate to have a valid entry (I have SGTools disclaimers on each and every giveaway page)
The person in question could have fiddled with the not received possibilities.
BTW just for the record: I do like SGTools; I do like the SGTools FAQ, I do like the SGTools devs/creators/guardians, I do like SGTools protected giveaways and I don't like cheaters and leakers! ^ ^
I hope that bad boys/girls with cheating intent will get it that there's nothing to win by cheating the SGTools system and a lot to loose!
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You show up as invalid entry for a few minutes(?) until the next sync to SG, if you just changed your username here.
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OO thank you, I didn't know that.
I'll be checking every winner in the train checker but (for the moment) it's good to see that I don't have any invalids to date.
Maybe just maybe that a number of the potential bad boys and girls do get it that there are consequences when you try to cheat the system and that the window is very fast closing on winning a SGTools giveaway by cheating. :-)
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I had misunderstandings with users, because they changed their username.
I love how some cheaters call themself out in the other sgt thread.
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As Oppenh4imer said above, this is SGT limitation, and KnSYS is aware of that. Fix is pending, besides, it's pretty rare issue.
BTW, bans are always issued on steamID.
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Thank you for your headsup Archi and may I say that I'm happy that my SGTools protected train is clean to date! :-)
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I'm happy too, perhaps people finally understood that deadly AI of ArchiBoT can connect cheaters with their profiles, and that won't end good for him ;).
And yes, I banned at least 3 leakers already, based on different data and different giveaways connected together by ArchiBoT.
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Got my first leak, and a pretty obvious one :x
Nobody got the private GA link except users who passed the SGT link.
I have the other name too if you need it.
c99e39c9-eba0-11e5-8d20-04019cc0dc01
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As i was reading the title i thought, if you get on the ban list, archibot will send the botnet to break your legs, but then i remember that Archi is not italian :o
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Hi JustArchi,
these people should be already known...but perhaps you have missed someone :D
532b0619-a4bf-11e5-b2c0-0663045ed9e8
a3c49893-a4cb-11e5-b2c0-0663045ed9e8
47665d44-a4cc-11e5-b2c0-0663045ed9e8
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Rather massive amount of people in the first link. Do you know where it got leaked?
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I guess these are the same people who already ruined the Melly Event (around Christmas Time) and some puzzle giveaways.As far as i know the leaked links were posted in a Russian forum/board but i don't know the exact URL,sorry.
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someone told me my giveaways were leaked to Russian forum and here is the link
Russian Community
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Thanks Archi,
Here are the lists, some rule breakers appear in different giveaways
dd39cafb-e87f-11e5-8e50-04019cc0dc01
6743a6bc-e87f-11e5-8e50-04019cc0dc01
18d4095d-e87e-11e5-8e50-04019cc0dc01
c45e6850-e885-11e5-8e50-04019cc0dc01
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Nice thing :)
but just a tiny picky question. maybe i just dont know the rules or never read that specific part, but theres something not quiet perfectly articulated in the exampletext imho.
["...Joining via leaked URLs is against SG and SGT services, and might lead to appropriate consequences..."]
if i compare that to
[".. Respect the privacy of invite only giveaways, and if you're invited to a private giveaway, do not share the link with other users unless given permission by the giveaway creator.."]
there is only mentioned that you shouldnt leak it, not mentioned that you shouldnt enter.
Ofc its implied but i for my part wouldnt write that as explicit as it is in the first part.
maybe i m just tired and fucked up by reading lawsuits... -.-
sorry to bother anyone who reads my crap & gn8
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http://www.steamgifts.com/support/tickets/new -> Request New Winner -> anything -> Leaked Giveaway
No, I'm not writing site rules. You should let SG staff know if you think that they're not clear.
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c4312b86-b3ac-11e5-83c7-0663045ed9e8
3c01adb1-b3ac-11e5-83c7-0663045ed9e8
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Done.
In order to save us some work, please report only giveaways with unique invalid entries. Example: If one user cheated in all your 5 SGT giveaways, it's enough to post only one giveaway as a "report" of that user.
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SGTools general thread
Do you like SGT cheaters? Neither do we. As you might know, we're taking seriously every attempt of exploiting SGT and your generosity, so we decided to work actively against people who can't play fair by joining SGT-protected giveaways they're not allowed to.
Process is quite simple:
Please make sure to include proper description in your SGT-protected giveaways, such as the one below:
This process is NOT automatic because we can't know if invalid entry is indeed invalid and obtained through leaked link, OR valid by your permission. That's why we ask you to report giveaways with invalid entries, after you've reviewed that those people are indeed cheaters.
Remember about no calling out rule on SG - don't report people, report SGT giveaways with invalid entries. Invalid entries are known only to you (and us - SGT staff). If you need a confirmation of people that have been banned by the system, let me know and I can send that info to you privately (e.g. on your steam comments wall).
Appeals to bans are reviewed by KnSYS in SGT general thread, please use this thread only for reports and questions/issues/discussion related to reporting system. Second thread was created in order to avoid polluting the main thread with reports, as it should stay informative and connected with discussion about SGT in general. Thanks!
In order to save us some work, please report only giveaways with unique invalid entries. Example: If one user cheated in all your 5 SGT giveaways, it's enough to post only one giveaway as a "report" of that user.
FAQ
Q: Are bans really permanent?
A: Bans are permanent and they're issued to people who try to bypass the system. They can however be lifted if they were given accidentally, and the affected user is in fact innocent, that's the only case, as user was banned by a mistake, and mistakes happen.
Q: Is the list of banned people available?
A: It's not yet decided if we want to make that info public or not.
Q: What's the point of that if cheaters were in fact bypassing the SGT?
A: Firstly, cheater will never ever be able to pass any SGT-protected giveaway by himself anymore. Secondly - with every cheater banned from the system, the odds of catching and banning the guy who committed the leak increase as well.
Q: What about potential abuse? I might want to send link to the guy just to see him banned
A: Decision whether to ban the suspected cheater or not is always upon SGT staff. There is no automatic system that bans everyone based on reports sent by user - every case is reviewed. If it turns out that somebody tried to abuse the report center by such action, he will get banned instead, and innocent user will be unbanned.
Q: What if invalid entry is a part of train powered by SGT?
A: Simply include both SGT giveawayID, and in addition to that - SG giveawayID that includes invalid entries (if it's different than the one behind SGT giveawayID)
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