The PA Alpha test was initially meant as a reward for high-tier Kickstarter backers. As such, if they offered it at the "normal" price, those early backers would be pissed.
I guarantee you that the release version of the game will be cheaper, but if you want to access the game early, you have to pay more. I don't see anything wrong with that.
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Exactly. You're paying more because you're getting more content, and getting to play the game before anyone else. Your $90 buys the full game, beta access, and alpha access. For the full game + beta, it'll be $70, and for just the full game, it'll probably be $50.
You pay more because you GET more. That isn't wrong. That's how capitalism works.
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Why is the beta $70? Why is the full game $50? For the kickstarter, they were $40 and $20, respectively.
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You pay more because you GET more. That isn't wrong. That's how capitalism works.
That's news to me. Wasn't aware that quantity is the only thing that affects pricing in a capitalist society.
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Wait, I GET the privilege of play testing their game....not for free, but I would have to pay to do their work for them? You support a business model in which they turn Quality Assurance into revenue stream? Feel like I am missing something here, but the only value add is for the developers here.
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No you are paying for the privilege to play the game EARLY and to have a say in shaping the future of the game. If you don't care for either, you either wait until the game goes live and the price is cheaper, or you don't buy it at all. Quite simple, really.
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lmao, privilege. Smarmy response is oblivious and smarmy. Pitch it any way you like, you are reducing QA costs for a company.
Straight from the developers mouth, only thing this high price is doing is providing prestige and exclusivity. If that isn't enough you are lying to yourself:
"Pricing the Alpha any lower than $90 would be a slap in the face to our Kickstarter backers who are just getting access now too", Uber's Bob Berry tells Kotaku. "We know we're losing money by having a high priced alpha, but its more important to us to honor our commitment to the existing community than to lower the price to get more money."
I am definitely interested in the game, but not $90 interested. adds to wishlist, hits Steam sale a year later
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You obviously don't get it. He has explained it to you a few different ways, but your point of view is "stuck" on "end-consumer" instead of "investor." There's a huge difference. Your analogy to that of a "QA tester" is also off.
Since explanation hasn't helped you at all, I'm going to limit myself to pointing out that you simply don't understand. Which is fine, by the way, and your decision to purchase later, at a cheaper price, is also fine.
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When you think people couldn't get any smarmier, they do!
Sorry, I simply don't buy marketing puffery and anecdotes such as: "privilege to play the game EARLY and to have a say in shaping the future of the game".
To me, playing a game in alpha is simply work and Steam currently does not equal Kickstarter. That is the schism. You can keep talking down to people, or realize that these are different perspectives. "Which is fine, by the way [...]"
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If it's work, then why are you interested in buying it early anyway? I wouldn't buy anything that was just work, even i fit was cheaper than when it came out. Ergo, we can conclude that it isn't "just work." It is, in fact, early access to a game. You can choose to post bug reports and your opinion on certain aspects of development, or you can choose not to. They aren't forcing you to QA test their game, and they certainly aren't hiring you to do it, so it is in no way work.
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I think you need to look up the definition of smarmy because you certainly aren't using it correctly.
The privilege to play the game early isn't "marketing puffery", it's what early KS backers were paying for at certain reward tiers. Why can't Steam be like Kickstarter with Early Access? Because you say so? Early Access is something recently created by Steam and I'm pretty sure if they didn't like what was going on, they would have stopped it. Again, if you don't want to pay that much, then wait for it to go cheaper, like you said. That's the beauty of a free market.
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Nope, you seem to fit the definition just fine! "Quite simple, really."
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Alpha. You are paying to be an alpha tester. Back before the 2010's, companies used to pay you to debug their games. Now it seems it's the other way around.
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Go buy your XBOX One and leave us oldtimers in peace.
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Then perhaps you should get with the times and buy a console before you end up like the old man on the street corner.
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What a coincidence. Well, I'm not an "old man" but I'll be on a street corner very soon when my apartment lease expires.
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I bought Minecraft in Alpha for like $10 or something, I forget. It went UP with full release, not down. Who the fuck wants to play $50 MORE to test a barley function game.
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Just because one game does something doesn't mean all games have to do something. If people don't want to pay an extra $40 for alpha and beta access, then good on them. They don't have to, they can wait. Nobody complains when Kickstarters or MMOs have higher tiers that give beta access and alpha access as rewards. And that's all this is; a higher tier.
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As an avid Total Annihilation and Sup-Com player who sunk thousands of hours between those two games + the expansion to the latter. I would loved to have supported the game sooner.
I didn't even know they were making this game until I first saw it appear on "coming Soon" in Early Access. The fact is if they wanted $90 for Alpha, sure that is a cool reward for Kickstarter but Steam is not Kickstarter. They should have honestly waiting until the beta to put it on Steam, or have the Steam page offer all tiers and explain WHY it is so expensive on the Steam page. Seeing it pop up on new releases and then seeing $90 was soul crushing, and it was not explained why until you dug into it through their site or Kickstater page. It was very badly managed.
The other way I see it is, the difference between Beta at $60 and Alpha at $90 is a fucking digital artbook. That is a one damn expensive PDF file, like holy shit. If they made it $40 for game, $50 for beta, $60 for Alpha, $90 for "collectors" and $200 for idiots. It would be fine.
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The difference between Alpha and Beta is getting and playing the game a few months earlier, plus potentially having a larger impact on shaping the game. You'd have realized this if bitching about the price wasn't the most important thing right now.
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Early backers pissed vs. everyone else on Steam being pissed. Which is worse again?
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Early backers. If they break the trust of them, how many would bother Kickstarting the next game? Steam players can just suck it up and buy it later.
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Then do that and deprive yourself of what might be a damn good game. What do I care?
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Key word might
I also never said that I was in either camp. Please don't single me out so aggresively.
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I wasn't, merely answering the possibility of someone being in that camp.
As for might, well, that's a chance you have to take with any game. Even great reviews and recommendations don't mean it'll be a good game for you.
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As for your second paragraph: I agree. That's why I play demos, watch gameplay vids, read reviews. It's always why I never preorder games.
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2013
thinking there's demos for games
Lawl. :( We live in sad, sad times...
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There are ways to "demo" a game that doesn't have a demo. I commonly watch gameplay vids of them. Other people find other ways, like asking a friend to describe it, reading reviews, and such.
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That's not what a demo is. That's reading reviews and watchig trailers. That's not a demo, not even close. A demo is to play the game for yourself and possibly to find out how well it works on your machine.
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Well,t here are other ways to demo a game without a demo, still. Don't really want to go into it in too much detail, but ways do exist.
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Yes, it's called The Pirate Bay, but my point was that games should have demos full stop. There shouldn't need to be other ways.
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I totally agree. Maybe steam could actually implement a feature like 10-30 min. playable demo's, either with or without publisher approval. I think the On Live service does that, but the problem with steam is it doesn't have a streaming service so you would have to DL the game in that case.
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I didnt say officially released demos. But I have to agree with your last post - devs really need to release more legit demos.
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Agree with this as well. The high price is for those who missed out on the kickstarter but still want to get the alpha and beta access or simply put can't wait to play this game.
For everyone else who doesn't want to pay such a high price, WAIT! I really don't understand why people don't seem to get this. Just wait and in a few months or maybe even as late as a year from now the game, as a finished product, will be within the normal price range of games.
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What they now call "Early Access" is a hardcore form of pre-order. As such, it should carry advantages, preferably of the monetary kind. 10% off seems to be the standard on Steam, for example.
My compliments to the evil genius of marketing that convinced you this makes sense.
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I didn't use the word "entitled", but preorders favor the seller, which get sure money, early money, money spent before the buyer has a chance to read reviews or opinions about the game. Thus the incentives.
Now if you want to pay "more", whatever more means in the context, as a form of support, that's great.
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"should carry advantages" is a phrase that denotes an entitlement. You feel entitled to advantages because you preordered. But you aren't. You are entitled to get exactly what you pay for. In some cases, they also offer you incentives, but they don't have to. In some (rarer) cases, they charge you for getting early access.
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I'd say an entitlement is an objective condition, while the word "should", in this context, expresses my intepretation of facts and conditions. So I agree I am only entitled to what I pay for, but I believe I should be given incentives to preorder, since I am doing "them" a favour.
By the way, who would ever preorder (not early access) on Steam without incentives, since there's no scarcity of digital items and no additional hassle in buying a game the moment it's released (or better, after having read a couple of reviews)?
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Well, this isn't a preorder though. You aren't paying retail price to get access to a game on release. You are paying a huge premium, a kickstarter price, for early access to a game. And a lot of people preorder games on steam, even when they come with no benefits. I don't see why, but they do.
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Well, considering the game is still in alpha and what you're buying on Steam is an early access, it actually makes sense. When they had the Kickstarter campaign you needed to pledge $90 to get alpha access, so why would it be any different now? It'll probably go down to $40 once they reach beta.
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Actually it doesn't make any sense! Usually when you're pre-ordering/getting an early access, you either get a ton of bonuses but with a normal price or you get a low price/discounted until it will eventually raise the price until the game is fully released.
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But this is not a pre-order, this is alpha access. There already are hundeds of people who got alpha access from their Kickstarter campaign, and my guess is that they put the game on Steam because it's convenient, the game is going to be on Steam anyway, and the whole early access thing makes things like this possible. If the early access were any cheaper on Steam, it would be unfair for those who made this game possible in the first place.
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Just because they priced it $90 on Kickstarter, it doesn't make it right. Just because it's alpha/early access doesn't mean that you should pay more!
All the games that I can remember, like Kerbal Space Program or Don't Starve, they are/were all early access and not only it doesn't cost more, it actually costs less and the price slowly rises when it gets closer to the release!
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Nobody is forcing you to pay it. If you're interested in the game but think it's currently overpriced, wait until it's out of beta and you'll save yourself $50. If you MUST play it now, then there's a premium to do so. Makes perfect sense, you're just being ignorant.
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Never leave your country. You might be surprised how much others need to pay.
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I know you aren't when I am. I've paid up to $150 for some games at release.
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I see, but i guess it really depends on your earnings too. The average pay here is 250 $ luckily my mom has somewhat higher pay, but full price games are still too expensive for me as i have priorities such as food and college books so i can buy games myself one day :)
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Right now I'm getting $233 a week. Unemployment though, so it wouldn't be much. Obviously, new games are rare for me as well. :P
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What...? If a company wants to charge $500 for a game they're well within their rights to do so and it IS right. It's their game. It's their product. If you don't like the price then don't buy it. It's as simple as that. Why is there this strange notion that you are entitled to the game somehow?
If it IS too expensive then people won't buy it and the devs will get the message that maybe they priced their game too high. Then they'll lower it. That's how pricing works. No one is going to set the price of their product at a price no one is going to pay (at least not for long). The game is $90 because there're people who want to pay that to play it in its current condition.
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The game is $90 because there're people who want to pay that to play it in its current condition.
It would be very interesting to see how many early access orders this actually gets on Steam, considering all the backlash.
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If the devs are content with the number of orders they get at that price then that's their business. Price is a balance between demand and whether the seller is happy with that demand or not. I don't expect they'll get that many orders to be honest. But the have already gotten some and they will get some. Again, it's their business whether they're happy with that or not.
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I understand why they are charging this price on steam, but i think its consumer exploiting at the point the game costs twice the amount of a AAA title. And all that while the game is in alpha, so you don't really know what is going to be in the actual game and how its gonna look like. It looks to me like warz all over again
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Ah, I can understand that concern. But once again, simple answer: don't buy. Those who do are taking that risk. It's the same situation if it was $50. It's still a gamble and buyers/backers still don't know the final product. They're asking for a higher gamble and it's entirely up to the customer whether they choose to take that gamble or not. The best you can hope for is that they keep to their word on whatever they've said would be in the game for sure. That's how kickstarter games are all the time. Just because this one's price is higher doesn't make it wrong. It just means the stakes are higher and the buyer should probably think about it more.
Edit: a little add on.. They also might be asking such a high price specifically to have a smaller player base right now. If you invest $90 on a game then you're serious about it. You're less likely going to be some whiny kid who can't understand the stage the game is in. If the majority of their alpha player base was like that and the game had some horrible bugs and some shit storm brewed over it it could be bad for the game's actual release. Again, this is mere speculation.
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I get what you mean, but i still think its overpriced and not really justly so. I think its a bad practice to price a game that much and that they offer no rewards for it. I know its a matter if you buy it or not, but i think the decision itself is wrong, never mind if and who buys it or not. Again, i sorta understand why the price is like this on steam, but i think it was wrong to put it this high on kickstarter too
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Its justified by the people who paid that when they weren't even sure when the game would release. If people don't like it, they can wait for the full release. For now, the price is set to be fair to the people that ensured the game would happen. They already paid that price, and there are others who paid for the beta, and that is their reward for that extra cash.
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This exactly (60$ in beta, 40$ on release). Can't you people understand this? They followed this path with their kickstarter and can't just change their plans anymore, otherwise they'll upset a lot of kickstarter backers!
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Sure, they did it like this, but that doesn't make it right.
Take Kerbal Space program for example, right now it's about $23 but as they've stated in their description, the games's price will slowly raise as they get closer to the release date. Same thing happened with the Don't Starve!
I'm sure there are more examples, but those are what came to my mind.
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Those weren't Kickstarter games. You clearly don't understand how KS/crowd-funding works.
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Yep, totally am, but NOT for early access, just the $15 tier.
But that's entirely the point - those that KS'd it for early access would be pissed if people could suddenly get the same benefits for cheaper. The whole point of KS is to support the development of a game and get rewarded with a discount for doing so.
Let me guess, you've never backed a KS project, eh?
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Since when is a discount even implied? Look at Shadowrun Returns for example. The lowest tier was 20 bucks for a preorder, and the preorder on steam is 13. If anything, people should expect a Kickstarter to be MORE expensive since you're giving money to the developer out of generosity and to support them, not just because you want to buy a good game when it comes out.
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Thought so.
You don't get my point. I know that's how they did it on KS but that doesn't mean what they did was right! They're the first one who I've seen to this backwards! It's always the other way around, Early access is cheaper until the game gets released! Hell, some games even have free Early Access, but the finished game costs money.
No, I've never Backed a KS project, not because I didn't want to. If I could I would have done it for Chivalry. Paypal isn't available where I live, so yeah, I couldn't back it up.
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Just because some title do this, this doesn't make it the norm. Look at Dota 2.. It's still in beta and going to be F2P. And what about now? It cost 23€ to get access in beta. Well with the spamming of Dota 2 keys it's kinda useless to buy it but you get the point of it. If you want early access pay something more. Until then you have to wait until release like everybody else...
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You are paying for the bonus items by buying Dota 2 for $30.
Edit: PA also gives some stuff. Regardless, you are arguing that people pay money only to access alpha/beta and did not consider bonuses.
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It gives you access to the game befor it's finished. The intention behind PA beeing on Steam isn't the same KSP or Don't Starve ect. has, before it's released. They also could just wait until it's done and then go to steam. The only reason they already on steam is for all the KS backers with alpha and beta keys. Because all (also all who just bought the final game) get keys for Steam so a person who may want all their games (if finished or not) on steam has the opportunity to. And also with the Steam inferface news thingy whatsoever it's also an easy way to stay informed about the development stages. In my opinion they shouldn't sell it at all on steam until release. So that the $90 Tier from KS to get alpha access is really exlusive.
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So? You aren't the capitalism police. Let them handle their game however they feel like it.
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Kickstarter was $40 for beta and $20 for release. Care to give an explanation as to why the alpha follows kickstarter but not anything else?
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The game doesn't cost $90, it's the game AND early access to alpha/beta tests that costs $90. This game was made possible through Kickstarter, and higher tiers got earlier access, so non-Kickstarter early access prices need to be high too for it to be fair to backers. If you wait for the game to actually be released, the price will be cheaper.
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Then don't pay for it until it's out of beta. If you want to play it early, you have to pay a premium. I didn't see anyone complain that the early access Dota 2 pack was $40 for a Free-to-Play game!
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And before the Dota 2 beta invites started being handed out like crazy, it was one of the only ways to get into the beta without being lucky.
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You clearly don't get the point. I can't believe someone can be so ignorant.
NOBODY IS FORCING YOU TO PAY THAT MUCH!
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Similarly, I bought the "Kiwi Pack" for Path of Exile to get guaranteed beta access, knowing the game would be free-to-play at launch (which it now is). That was my own choice...I wanted to play and I wanted to support the devs.
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The smallest pack contained only beta access and was somewhere between $5-20, can't remember.
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I'm not interested in the game whether it was 5$ or 100$, maybe after some reviews. I also fully support developers setting whatever price they want. If they want to set it at 200$, or an indie platformer at 90$, then that is completely up to them.
My reply was to this reasoning.
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No, I'm not saying it's an honor at all. It's a privilege. You pay more, you get the "benefit" of early access, elsewise you wait for the actual release and pay the base price. Do other games have free alpha/beta? Of course! But many of them are handed out to a select few, be they chosen specifically or randomly. This model allows "everyone" early access, so long as they're willing to pay.
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In most software development people are paid by the hour to have the 'privilege' of testing software before it ships.
And as it has been constantly stated in this thread, everyone else does the pricing the other way around. A discount for the work that is put in.
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I guess I just don't understand where the outrage lies. If people don't want to pay extra to get into alpha/beta, they don't have to (I certainly didn't!). You can still pre-order the actual game from their site for what I assume will be the retail price, or perhaps slightly lower ($40). They just decided to keep their alpha/beta price higher to be fair to backers.
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Nobody at all is forcing you to do work. Even if you choose to partake int he alpha and beta, you are not forced, at any point, to take time out of playing to file a bug report. You can choose to, and the devs would appreciate it, but you are not required to, literally, metaphorically, practically, or virtually.
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So the alpha access costs 50 usd....not bad. I remember the time, when people had not to pay for "alphas". Alphas are there not because they are worth investing. They are there to polish the game. Gamers HELP the DEvs in those tests. It is ridicoulous and unfair to take more money than the finished product will cost for only providing the user to 2 weeks alpha. On Kickstarter and on Steam this is unacceptable. Either sell the game at 90 when it finishes or give the alpha free for people who preordered! How can a company bee that greedy...
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Uber loves overpricing stuff in SMNC, but to be fair its mostly 99% appearance stuff in that though, this seems a bit much, honestly the game looks amazing and they can probably get away with about 40-50.
Why bring up the Russian price? Its always cheaper for pretty much everything gaming related in Russia correct?
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It's not an error, I've been following this game for a while. They have tiers, but Steam apparently gets only one choice.
Tier 1 is thirty bucks, i think, and it only includes preorder. Tier 2 is 50 for beta, and tier 3 is 90 for alpha. There's also tier 4 for 200.
They think it will weed out the riff raff and make sure only serious gamers can get the alpha. Their reasoning kinda pisses me off and makes me not want to get it at all. They also say it's to avoid screwing over the kickstarter backers by suddenly dropping the price.
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that's ridicules,I've been waiting for this game since Nerdcube did a video on it,after seeing the price i will have hard time to decide whether its worth it or not (probably not)
in my opinion that game should cost under 25$...but it seems like it'll drop down it's price since just few people can afford 90$ for it
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Read their FUCKING Steam page:
**Our pricing for this stage of early access was determined by our Kickstarter. The stages of our early access for ALL users, which was determined during our Kickstarter, is:
June through August: $90 for early alpha access, during the time where we're still locking down features and making tweaks to the flow of the game.
September through November: $60 for beta access. The game will be much more complete at this time,
Kids nowadays. Too lazy too read.
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So because you didnt had faith in this particular game and you didnt participated in Kickstarter, where to get alpha access you had to pay that much, you want that everyone else who paid that much getting screwed? Because in reality there were a lot of people who backed that game at that price so they can participate in Alpha stage and see how game is developing, but you are like fuck them, its too expensive. No it isnt, its a privilege to participate in alpha where your feedback can potentially have impact of some developers choices. So just suck it up and wait.
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The point of KS is to support the Devs, to fund them so they'd be able to develop the game. You'll also get the game and probably some extra stuff!
I'm saying this for like 100th time, just because they did it on KS, doesn't mean they should turn Steam into a KS project too! They're doing it backwards! This is the first time I've seen a developer ask for more money for an early/alpha access! It's always cheaper, hell in some cases it's even free!
They can cut some of the privileges you get by buying the game on steam comparing to KS and Lower the price. this way, the KS backers won't get screwed because they got something extra (not the early access obviously!)
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I understand where are you coming, but this isn't a KS project anymore, now this is a PRIVILEGE to get this kinda access for this game, and yeah it's because of the KS pricing that this has come to this kinda situation a unique one. So we can only live with it and see how the game will shape up.
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I wonder when it became a "privilege" to debug a game.
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Oh boy. 1) "It's always cheaper, hell in some cases it's even free!" Obviously it isn't "always" or it would be in this case as well. The developers have the right to set the price at w/e they feel like it and you have no right to complain. Don't like it, don't buy it. 2) "(not the early access obviously!)" Well, they were promised early access as a reward for kickstarting, so you cannot take that from them without having lied to them. Imagine how pissed off everyone would be if they lied about what you got on the kickstarter page.
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You are a tad slow it seems. If you really read it than it says that: Our pricing for this stage of early access was determined by our Kickstarter. So it's already been said by the time of the kickstarter and after a while $60. Which you said would be what you expected. And you can't say that it makes no sense. The developer determines the pricing for reasons. Maybe they are total out of publisher money + most of the money from the kickstarter is already gone.
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If pricing were determined buy the kickstarter, the beta would be $40 and the game itself would be $20. Note that they are only following the kickstarter guideline for the alpha version.
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It IS the Steam store, but it's still alpha time. They had higher tier pricing for earlier access on KS. If they allowed people to purchase now, those who kickstarted would be pissed and it would probably hurt them more than doing it this way. However, I think putting the game up for sale on Steam Early Access was just a bad idea. They should have left it until the game released, if they really didn't want to anger their player-base. Nobody will pay the $90 to be a game tester for them - it's just silly.
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That's kinda my point.
The whole idea of KS is to help the devs to get started (hence the name, Kickstarter) but just because it cost $90 on KS doesn't mean they should do the same thing on steam. All the games I've seen either had cheap price because it was in Alpha state or even the alpha was free and you had to pay for the game when it was outta alpha.
Long story short, $90 on KS was fine, but on steam it's ridiculous.
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It was a bonus for the kickstarters, so if you want the same you have to pay the same. They already said that the price will lower with the time, so I can´t see anything bad with it.
They use Steam to distribute the game and use their servers, not to get more money at the moment.
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Lol!
2x the price of a new full game release... Wut.
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I get the point of their pricing. Don't wanna piss off the Kickstarters who paid the higher price for early access. People who paid on Kickstarter would be up in arms if the price were lower, and they'd want their money back. It would scream lawsuit for the devs. I also think it was just a bad idea to put it up for sale on early access. Many games that are available for purchase in alpha or beta are cheaper than the final product because you're supporting the team early. Instead of promoting good will, they are just angering potential buyers. I get it, and I think where they went wrong was allowing sales of the game via Steam Early Access.
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I don't understand the outrage here. The game's clearly going to be priced around 20$ when released. (kickstarter tier of 20$ gets you the game when released officialy)
They basicly added an option to opt in on the kickstarter alpha pack via steam.
Game will be out later, at a much lower price because they want to give their backers to enjoy the benefits.
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http://steamcommunity.com/games/233250/announcements/detail/1658730021561594175
it's the decision we had to make
It's ok guys, they HAD to make it
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Early Access games so far have been double or even triple the projected retail price; I'm not entirely surprised.
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didn't read LOL.....will most people say, but I did so I know that the prices are like this because of the Kickstarter campaign and I think it's fair to the Kickstarter people, but probably only very few people are gonna buy it right now, so the Early Access right now is quite useless ^^
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Hey,
I've been waiting for this game to be available on the store, I knew it was going to be expensive, but I thought more like $50 or $60!
Guess what? It's 90 freaking dollars! What the hell?! Early Access game, an incomplete game, for $90?! No thank you...
What do you think about the price of Planetary Annihilation?
Edit: The Russian price is a lot cheaper! It's ~$38 and doesn't seem to be region restricted!
Edit: The Russian price was increased to 2499 rubles on June 15th 2013.
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