What do you think about the system?
Nope. I realized this after I quit an group who downvote other reviews just to improve their own reviews. Otherwise most of the time the review with most upvotes would be at top ( example.- change the language at german and you`ll see, that my review is not at the 1st position with 3 more upvotes. ) I know that comments and length are part of the algorithm too, but downvotes change the result as well.
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Jokler is right, but it wasn't part of the initial review system, it was added later when it was obviously necessary.
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I write, sometimes, previews. A part in english and a part in german. I prefer in the last months german because i don't see very often reviews in german and sometimes i don't want use my brain for translation and would be happy over more previews in german :o).
[Bad english because it is 1 AM here and i come from a birthday party... the drinks got better and better with each glass :-D]
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A up/down system is useless for deciding how good a game is. I'd much rather have a 5 star, 1-10 or percent system that you could give scores. That way you could separate the good games from the great games. Or more important, the slightly bad vs the terrible/asset flip games.
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Why separate the systems instead of combining them? Improving it with the percent system can be an advantage, especially if you dont want recommend a game because its not bad or good or just not for everyone. I am missing a neutral option at the moment.
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I mean each individual review should be able to give a percent score. Right now the percentage is only of the people who gave up votes vs down votes. Basically, my problem is this is this: if I enjoyed a game (say a 6.0 out of 10), I'll give it a thumbs up. If it was game of the year(say a 9.5 out of 10), it gets a thumbs up. No differentiation in the current system though. Same thing for games that I thought were boring (say a 4 out of 10) vs an asset flip/unfinished game (a 1 out of 10).
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On the other hand i greatly prefer a much more simplified Yes/No/Maybe system instead of a score rating. Scores are extremely subjective and people will just look at the number (or stars, or whatever) and complain about it because the score wasn't 9.2, but a 9.1.
I just gave up on giving points, if you want to know if the game fits for you just read the review.
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I almost exclusively read reviews from friends with similar taste in games, but when I do read the other Steam reviews, it's always the negative reviews. They typically contain more useful information, in my opinion, and if I still want a game after reading the negatives, I know it's a game I really want.
So I guess my TLDR answer would be "needs to be improved."
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The thing is just a few people leaves reviews for the games they own, and the curators are pretty much unknown from most of Steam users & the few who leaves some reviews didn't judge really the game for what the game is, like the ones who leaves just 1 word or something like "the game is too hard" or "I can't launch the game, this is shit" with an Intel Pentium PC & a lot of insults ... In overall the reviews seems pretty accurate, good game have high scores and bad ones a big red text but maybe they can add other options ?
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IMO the core issue with the review system is that you can only rate 100 or 0. Not many games are truly 0, and even less many games are truly 100.
Steam forces us into this fake dichotomy, and it not only breaks the global rating, but also incentivize people to defend a point of view more clear-cut than they might really want to, and discourages neutral reviews (doesn't deserve a thumb up, but doesn't deserve a thumb down either = move on to sth else).
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User reviews are inherently flawed since they aren't an indicator of whether a game is good or not, they're indicators that people got what they expected. This is why weeb VNs are some of the highest rated games, because most people already know if they'll enjoy it or not the moment they see it.
I'd love if user reviews could be more in-depth with points and such, but every user has their own heuristic so there'd still be problems. Mostly I just want a better system for identifying and notifying people of hardware incompatibilities.
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Cant agree with your first point. I played a lot of games and there were a lot of games I did not know before, especially when they were part of a bundle I bought. Sometimes I never heard something about the game and I played them and getting surprised how good/bad it is. When you play Far Cry 5 you`ll get what you know from other Far Cry titles. If you liked the one before, why should you change your opinion? Never change a running system!
I think that bots and fake-accounts is a greater problem for the system...
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Well for bots and fake accounts they still have to buy the game (key activations don't count towards review metrics), so most devs can't fake that without wasting a bunch of money. Plus if you catch them in the act you can blacklist them from Steam for whatever that's worth.
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Fake accounts and bots can increase the amount of group member and follower at curator page. They can also comment and influence the algorithm this way. Also there was a a "scandal" years ago, when someone blackmailed developers with his group size. What happened? Nothing! Steam ignored it and the group is still workin. Bots and fake accounts do not only affect the system with up/down votes. If you want more information, feel free to contact me.
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I can definitely see the first happening, but I'm pretty sure the Steam algorithm is based on sales. There's been talk among devs about release discounts being absolutely necessary since your algorithm stats are mostly based on your first two weeks of sales.
If you've got an article for the second, feel free to throw it on here. It's always fun to see Valve's incompetence.
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I'd love if user reviews could be more [...]
[I'm replying on mobile and can't copy/paste, sorry for cutting the quote short]
Hmm... that could be a curious way to do it. Have maybe five user-filled 0-10 boxes for each review. Most reviewers would probably use them for things like "Graphics", "Story", "Sound", "Gameplay", and whatever, but others could use more appropriate things for their interest in a particular game like "Bugs", "Cards", "Nude Scenes", etc. all ranked 0-10. Average each of them out and rank them in order of popularity... should be good for the serious interests and meme-throwers alike, though we'd inevitably get some things spammed to the top still like the joke tags that are already on Steam Store game pages.
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most things can always be improved, but considering it's a gaming platform with people from all ages and cultures i think it's not so bad. you just need to filter a lot of useless and probably biased reviews and read the ones that appear honest (both neg. and positive ones).
anyway, if i really want something i don't even bother with reviews, there are better ways to find out of you like something, like gameplay videos.
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So, the review system is mostly dumbass.
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I didn't notice that before. Makes things slightly less dumbass.
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There absolutely should be a 1-10 points system. Naturally some (simple minded) people would still vote everything with either 1 or 10 points then, but not a majority. There are several sites, such as IMDb, which prove that such a system can provide reliable and meaningful information.
Damn, I could imagine so many interesting statistics they could provide.
"Show me the highest rated games with the tag y for gamers older than 30, with 1k+ hours in grand strategy games".
Instead we get thumbs up or down and they wreck the few valuable data miners, such as Steam Spy ... hooray!
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I think it'd be hugely beneficial towards finding games I want to play. For instance, I imagine Paradox strategy games are very polarizing due to their complexity. This means they likely would have a high number of 9/10s for the people who these games target but also a good number in the middle/low for those who think it's too complex. I'm much more interested in seeing games that some people thought was amazing even if others did not than games that everyone agreed was fun but not really good.
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That was my idea. Instead of relying on friends only, it would absolutely be possible to define groups of people that meet your criteria for providing valuable input. And it would be 100% anonymous.
It's really a shame how ignorant Steam/Valve is in that regard. Players, developers and publishers - they all want as much quality data as possible. And I don't see any reason at all why they shouldn't provide it, while privacy remains intact. And it's not like they'd lose any essential business secrets if we'd know some more.
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Needs to beimproved at least in one point: to allow neutral reviews. Like mentioned above - so far we got dichotomy: good or bad, but some games are average (more or less). Those are nor totally bad nor epic titles also - good to play for 10 minutes or any spare time you got now. I couldn't make a negative reviwe about them, but sometimes I don't feel like giving those positive either. Middle option would be nice.
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Ist doch eh alles fake. Brauchst dir da doch nur die ganzen Reviews anzuschauen von Leute die ihre Keys kostenlos erhalten haben. Diese Reviews haben alle eines gemeinsam, die wurden positiv bewertet. Die Reviews lese ich mir schon seit Jahren nicht mehr durch, besser ich mache mir selbst ein Bild mit der Demo (wird natürlich immer mehr eine Rarität) oder einem Test Video auf youtube.
Mit der Abschaffung des Downvote Buttons hat Valve ebenfalls den Sinn der Reviews mitabgeschafft.
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Definitely needs to be improved, an example I could find:
https://store.steampowered.com/app/495890/Montaro/, a meme game that got Overwhelmingly Positive ratings
https://store.steampowered.com/app/65980/Sid_Meiers_Civilization_Beyond_Earth/, a good serious strategy game that got mixed scores..
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Yeah, it’s all about personal opinions than actual review of the game. I played both games, 30 hours sucked in and well spent in civ vs less than 1 hour of repetitive gameplay in montaro. Just an example of how flaw/subjective the steam review system is. There’re also Zup games that usually have very positive ratings lol
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Just for the sake of arguement - Civ Beyond Earth is objectively the weakest of (3?)-4-5-6-BE by quite much, according to the fans of the genre. How do you plan to apply the "it's what it seems (Zup and such that are fun while they last, like an hour) or Beyond Earth that's a weak copy of the better games. It's like comparing fastfood pizza to a homemade - pizza-pizza, better than eating a bun with a slice of cold cut, but there are still a big gap between the two - while having the sameish price.
Don't forget that beyond Earth is 40€, the dog-game is like... 1? Civ 5 is 30, Civ 4 is 20, with both having better availability from bundles.
It's not just % reviews, it's % reviews to face what the game offers compared to it's price and the market.
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Every time I read some reviews of a game in my native language, I see the same "This is a good game because I liked it" and "This is a bad game because I didn't like it" (usually it is said with different words, but it is the same meaning) or stupid jokes.
The problem is not the system, the problem are the users who write useless reviews.
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Nah, the problem is that Steam requires anyone to write a review if all they want is to rate the game. If they'd end that requirement we'd see 2 improvements:
The system IS the problem.
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I think it should be possible for users to give their thumbs up / down vote without the need to write something. This way they could rate how they like, we get less of these useless one sentence reviews and it would be easier to find some good reviews.
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Better than it was, still needs a lot of work.
I keep wondering if my down votes of useless reviews and up votes of useful reviews just mean Steam shows me more useless random reviews at the top as my "reward" for being a helpful review feedback voter instead of showing me the reviews that are actually widely voted as being useful.
(Right now, my settings are set such that I see reviews from three different languages. One of those in particular is more frequently useless than the others.)
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I don't think the review system can be fixed in any way. There are tons of trolls on steam who go through reviews and post nonsense on purpose and they troll reviews by spamming the funny button on them.
Not to mention all those reviews which are marked as "product received for free" and activated by key and not bought from steam directly. 99.99% of them are fake no matter what the game is. Publishers give keys for free to people that get lots of attention and these people post positive reviews always even though the games are garbage so they can get more free keys in the future for other games. And they suck in gullible people to buy their garbage games thinking they are not bad.
I don't think Valve can do anything about it. There will ALWAYS be people who try to abuse the system for their own profit.
Personally I always write exactly what I think about a game on my reviews. Even if I get free key for a game at some point in the future I will still write a bad review for it if it is bad.
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Sure it's nice when people spent their time and efford to write proffessional-ish reviews but I never considered this system as ment to publish reviews. It it more like place were people can voised their general impression about game. And few sentences is enough, I think. Just mention graphics, story, gameplay and bugs and will consider such "review" helpfull.
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The general idea isn't bad, but people misuse it - there is no set quality in reviews, some people just want their voice to be heard while they have nothing to say with reviews like " it was okay I guess". The binary system to show how useful a review is is just plain bullshit, vengeance- and disagreement-downvotes all around Steam, and now with hiding the amount of downvotes AND the ability to turn off commenting on reviews, nothing can stop a completely wrong review to be top if enough people (like fans, followers) vote on it, with no indication that it's not even true.
The most useful way I can use the reviews is to connect ~ 10% jumps to expressions, and that's still only about the general quality of the game, one needs to read after what the game is and how it works. Like 90%+ is generally a great game. 80-95% means it's good, but there are some disagreements about it, enough to worth look into what people find problems. 70%ish is similar, more likely unoriginal or couldn't flash out the general ideas, so it's a bit lacking. 60%ish can have great ideas but if a game is this low in mass reviews, it's guaranteed to have pretty serious and widespread problems that one needs to know if they can tolerate.
The way reviews work, and people think that their review is enough to be a "it's fine" or "it's shit, and also I didn't read what the game is but it's different what I thought it is" is fucking up the objective usefulness of them. It would be better to have proper reviewers with information in their reviews, but problem is that I guess Steam intended curators to be that (and doesn't work) and that the way store pages work, one needs to open a longer review in full page to be well readable, otherwise it's a very narrow, very long, hard to read mess.
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I think as someone mentioned above, dislikes do matter and affect the helpfulness alogarithm of how reviews are displayed.
But I do think that they should make it return though.
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I second the idea so many others have for a ?/10 scoring system.
Or at the very least, a "neutral /neither recommend or not recommend" option.
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It's okay, but you can only vote if you like or if you dislike a game.
But what if you like the game, but it actually costs to much ?
What if you are not sure ?
What if the game is just okay ?
I like some ideas over here.
10 points rating system would be great, also deleting the short reviews, wich are spamm.
They need also to improve the comments under the reviews, because my comments are always to long.
I know. It is not Facebook, but sometimes I feel like the game is worth to be talked about.
So yes.... In my opinion it's okay, but it needs to be improved.
A new rating system with points or something like that would be great.
Because sometimes I am playing games wich I just don't like, but they are wll made, so I have to give a no, but I would love to give a 6/10 or a 7/10.
You can still translate the points to %. So every kid will understand it.
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It needs to be improved. It should have been a multiple starsystem. Were people can choose/create certain keywords to judge the game, something like:
-For each keyword you can tell something about it.
-If you select a certain keyword, you can find everything what all the people have said.
-Maybe also add some tags to your review, like Assetflipper
-Maybe also, reviews should only count if you played it for more than 1hour. Only problem is, that there are some legit games that are shorter than that.
Story 4/5
Gameplay 3/5
Character development 4/5
Artstyle graphics 5/5
Multiplayer 4/5
Developer reputation 3/5
This way a developer might be able to see why a game is good/bad and where to improve.
Some other stores already have a multiple starsystem, like google play, but only for a few keywords.
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I know people well enough to know they would just give scores to anything without any real explanation,
A number by itself doesn't say much, a good developer prefers to know why it failed/succeed rather than where
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There are a couple of threads ( 1 & 2 ) the last days about the review system at steam. I am writing reviews in my native language (german) too, because I think my german is much better than my english and its much better than the german from most germans. And so I decided to start my own curation two month ago.
The reason I`ve done that was, that I realized there are a lot of scumbags especially at germany, who abuse the system for their personal benefit. Most time I am going to read reviews to inform myself about the game by a "neutral" person who played the game. When I do that I watch the playtime, the lenght, the grammar and the design. But most of the time there are a lot of crappy reviews. Is this a global problem (cant check it for other countries, because I dont understand what is written)? Do you use the review system at steam (writer/reader)? What do you think about the system? What improvment is needed?
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