Why are so many people joining the giveaway at once? Are they all bots? So I'm doing giveaways for bots? And I participate in giveaways with bots? What's the point? There are more bots...

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Because it's hard to do it at twice.

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Yes, a high part are bots (autojoiners) and only a tiny part are so dumb to activate on top the thanks script that make them ultra visible. The thanks script is allowed, which is complete stupid because it is a additional part of the autojoiner program that can but must not be enabled.
If you raise the min. level for a public GA, this amount get lowered.

The only one that could do something against them is the owner of this site (cg) but he don't care since 6 years+

The other thing you can do is to blacklist such accounts, which have only a effect when you create own GAs.
And/or to join groups that check which users can enter their group (like my own).

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Yeah, I found that making the min. level for a public GA 3 really lowered the chances of a bot winning the giveaway.

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Or
It means those users are more experienced and involved with SG. Hence they know its unwise to enable 'Thank you' spammer within the tool. Also it isnt possible as fellow SG users, to say with certainty a thank you message is from a malicious user. IMO best approach is an SGtools enabled GA link

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i remember last year someone telling me i was a on list of botters because i said thank you on some giveaways,
i saw no comments on them and didn't want the creator to feel unappreciated,
so i'd say thanks to them to make them feel good, and got put on a list somewhere lol.

6 days ago
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You aren't on mine or a other list that i have access too (which should be a good part of the existing ones^^).

In general it is better not to write a generic thanks message for a created GA. A special message about the game, that it is a wishlisted game or such stuff is different and will not be seen as "generic" and this way you would not be seen as, possible, autojoiner with thanks script activated.
If you win a GA, it is off course, mostly liked to see a thanks.

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yeah i know that now, but when i started a year ago i was just feeling bad for seeing some giveaways without a thank you on them because they were cheaper games or unpopular and thought i was being nice lol,
didn't know the history of botters and all that stuff -that can mostly be solved by having a captcha check every hour or two-

6 days ago
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AI solve captchas better as humans, so the times of captchas to prevent something are over.
It only steal lifetime from the real humans and annoy them.

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yesterday actually one of my friends had to stream a captcha for me because she couldn't figure it out lol, it was one of the new weird one.
do you think there are any realistic solutions for the bot problem?

6 days ago
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cg have the tools, used 6 years+ ago for a few weeks.
He have all that it needs and he could activate it from time to time.
Maybe a 24/7 use would be to demanding/expensive for the traffic/servers but 1-2x/year, for sure, wouldn't.

So if he want, the problem would be much lower.

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Yes, I usually do the same.
If they have written something interesting in description then I might reply with something clever but most of the time I just write thank you out of courtesy.

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A special message about the game, that it is a wishlisted game or such stuff is different and will not be seen as "generic" and this way you would not be seen as, possible, autojoiner with thanks script activated.

that is so very generic, Masa.
also as an advice. 'cause is technically wrong.

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i saw no comments on them and didn't want the creator to feel unappreciated

Thank you for doing that. I try and do the same thing. I guess some people find it annoying, but eh.

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I did the same at some point and a user yelled at me lmao so I blacklisted them so they don't have to worry about me seeing their giveaways again and thanking them. I stopped giving so many thanks some time afterwards simply cause it was so time consuming and went to only thanking when I win or on some rare occasions I still say thanks to new users for giving or big giveaways.

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I mean, there are thousands of users here. If a hundred in a minute see your giveaway, and a hundred enter your giveaway, it may seems like a lot

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I fear a big part of the answer will indeed be bots, but I guess there is also the fact that with over a million users that means that there are only so many times that a user can look for GAs to join... Assuming only 1% off all users checks the site exactly once each day, that still means that 8 people check at the same minute. Not even accounting for uneven distribution of timezones etc.

But yeah, I I don't remember the last GA I made that did not have a level or group or puzzle protection 🤷‍♂️

EDIT: Hm, but the 1% seemed like a very random guess and the million level 0 users felt wrong too... If we change it to 176099 Level1+ users and an activity of 10(100)% then once a day would be 12(122) on the same minute

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Below 50k are active users.

The majority of the 1 mil. lvl 0 accounts are people that looked 1x, or a short time, into sg and never came back.

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that was me untill about a year ago, made my account 3 years ago but didnt use it for 2 years

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There's a lot of bots and the issue is barely being addressed lately, if at all. Although sometimes it may just look like botting, for instance when you open several GA's in new tabs before entering them and closing each tab.

You can make out most botters if you look a bit deeper though and logs don't lie, so the problem could've been addressed better if there was a motivation to do it, like it's already been done in the past.
Reports are a waste of time as mods prefer dealing with other tickets, understandably (and they want you to line a lot of time-consuming proof by yourself). The concept itself is ridiculous as it could've been automated.

What you can do is raise the level of your GA's to partly mitigate the issue (there's botters and exploiters at all levels) or gift in exclusive groups, which unfortunately isn't fair to honest low-level users.

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As other people mentioned, lots of bots.
It's been years since I won a game, I think. Too many bots to compete against.

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As site owner is a lazy and? greedy f... only solution is to abandon concept of community and keep your own giveaways behind different layers of bot protections. Alternatively you're donating to people who employ algorithms for their personal gain and make you look stupid as a giveaway creator.

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Every time I make a public giveaway, there's like 50 people joining inside an hour, regardless of the level req, game given away, starting date... I honestly don't think that even with 5 million users real people can scan the lists for giveaways so far in the future, what do they skip to page 7 by default?

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If you filter by wishlist then you won't have 10 pages of stuff to wade through to find what you are actually interested in, I almost never have more than one page of giveaways so when something new shows up I will see it the next time I check even if the end date is a month away..

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That makes sense, but are you saying that every random game I give away at some point is on 50-100 peoples wishlists? Maybe. It's not impossible.

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Don't forget a lot of users use the in-URL filters to filter by entry count, as well. So the fact that your giveaways don't have entries can be a factor in them getting entries (though, in fairness, that practice [when applied to "trashware" specifically] is mostly associated with bots and multiaccounts and new uers, so there's that).

Though if your giveaways are 20P or more to enter, and they're far in the future, that's often a sign people are just using the giveaways to bank points temporarily. So that's yet another possibility.

Not to say bots aren't a big thing again, I couldn't say, but there's definitely a lot of possibilities for these kind of things.

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No, if it's shovelware or something then it's almost certainly bots. I'm just saying it's not ALL bots when you get a bunch of entries right away.

5 days ago
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skip to page 7

There's also the new page.

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+1

And if you've filtered a ton of stuff on the site, the sort-by-new is honestly the best default sort go with in a lot of cases.
Just wish you could combine "new" and "wishlist', then I'd basically never have to do any other kind of filtering or sorting :P

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^This.

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This is what I use also. At breaks in between work, just pop onto this and enter the giveaways I want. Simples!

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TIL I don't use this website nearly enough to know how it works anymore lol

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I dont bot but i use the enhanced steamgifts & only browse from the wishlist (my bookmark goes straight into wishlisted)- with ESGST showing GAS as grid and allowing to just scroll (no next page) nowadays for me it takes 1 mouse scroll or 2 for me to see all GAs (because theyre filtered to be on my wishlist).
And heck, i have a HUGE wishlist (over 4k now), still my guess i dont get more then 2-3 pages on the wishlist tab

Right now ive been trying to save points because of community train and couple of bundles with wanted titles but most of the time/year theres a few most wanted i click imediatly when i see then; For example Hogwarts, only reason i didnt entered the current public GA is because its 20+ days away. Generally i have points left and just enter whenever i spot one

Then im currently mostly stuck at home(and kinda broke), and even when im working im on the pc with the browser one alt-tab away... generally every few hours i check on SG, and if im just killing time on the browser (say youtube) or idk, netflixing, its every hour or so between videos or episodes

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Try using ESGST. You can add a ton of filters and such, in order to make the many giveaways more manageable to view.

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I have hidden most games I don't want to play on steam gifts.. so I tend to only have a page of giveaways that ends up being games I want to enter for, or games that I have yet to hide 😂

It took awhile to first hide them all but has made it easier to tell if I want to enter something now.

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I see why a user once made fake giveaways stating that they are going to blacklist everyone that enters it, just to try and weed out some bots.

6 days ago
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Fake giveaways are not recommended. Here's some real ones already done simultaneously if you feel like filling up your list:
Giveaway 1 - Giveaway 2 - Giveaway 3 - Giveaway 4.
Lots of entrants taking the bait multiple times, with clear botter times. I just gave up checking at some point.

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Hmm can you point out one or two botters on that list so I can investigate for my research? Or what makes these people bots?

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No, I can't. You can check a user's entry times to the second and decide for yourself (either ESGST or page source code). It isn't rocket science.

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Don't waste your time with him.
He protect the cheaters since forever.

Answer the "why?" yourself.

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Lol did you just accuse me of botting because you got no data to show to prove your point? Nice, this is like 3rd grade behavior.

I have an acc with 10k games and my 3 alts are all public none of them even registered on sg to talk shit like some other losers around here do cause they're afraid to talk from their main. Go ahead investigate but if you find nothing, admit you're a bitch next time rather than spout your schizophrenia here.

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I see, many of those users I see entered your giveaways 6 minutes at least after they launched (all within 1 minute of each other), some have a minute difference to enter the next one. I'm able to open 100 chrome tabs with ctrl + middle mousewheel, then ctrl + w to close the tab as I'm clicking left mouse on every single one without having to move my mouse from that same spot. I could enter over 100 in a minute. This would mean multiple GA's within the same second. There's nothing wrong with doing this. You avoid all the spam descriptions sometimes with follow my youtube channel and subscribe to my patreon, donate to my gofundme and please also wishlist this game on steam and buy this using my curator link. That's stuff is annoying can you blame anyone for wanting to ignore it? Still not sure if this would trigger esgsts I don't use it, but if their data is as accurate as sgtools data is for the giveaways won/sent ratio, then it's wrong and the owner of that app never wanted to reply to me or admit it or provide a fix(LMAO) when I pointed out it's bug, so I'm more inclined to believe the app is wrong straight ahead over saying everyone's a bot like op, masafor and some other people tend to do.

I guess just to start off, if these people were bots, why did the first ones wait 6 minutes to enter your giveaway? Why not enter super fast like op says it happens or other people suggest some enter instantly.

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I didn't state they all were bots. Don't worry, I know how to read entry times and I'm aware of the use case you described. I'm not that dense. Cheers

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Wasn't claiming you said all were bots, but at least some of them, hence why I asked which so I can investigate and understand the pov.

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And if he would write which ones he would be suspended for calling out.... picard facepalm

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Sometimes you gotta take a hit to sustain a claim. He can also just add me and tell me in private if he wants to. If you're going to convince me you are right you gotta at least make some effort. I'm literally out here proving how every bot detection users use is incorrect and can be done legitimately by users unknowingly. Again duville never said most are bots, or many or bots just that some in that giveaway, so I'm interested even in those and what made them be bots if he wants to add me and explain it. But you've made these claims masafor. You add me and show me ONE. ONE single level 0 giveaway where 80% are bots that is public and lasted more than 1 hour. ONE thats it. Because you've claimed more % than this are bots at level 0. Show me. You ain't getting banned for outing someone to me in private. Prove me wrong and show me your data.

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Sorry, I'm in your blacklist. What's the deal with these giveaways? They have some kind of warning?

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There's literally nothing sus about them. If you go to the last page you'll see a bunch of the same users entering them, which makes sense, the giveaways were made within a minute of each other, the first giveaway wasn't even entered for 6 minutes after it was launched, and they're all dlc for the same game. If those same users were on the site a the same time looking for giveaways to enter and they didn't have the warhammer 40k dlc's and just the base game which is likely because they usually bundle the base game without the dlc's and then the complete editions with dlc's extra as keys then it makes sense they'd enter at the same time for the same 4 games listed in a row on the site for the dlc's they didn't own.

Sometimes this "these people are bots" talk is just user propaganda for people to join private groups and to bait users into having to give there instead, which makes the win ratio much better for those members. I don't think(correct me if I'm wrong) this has to do with duville but this whole bot talk is just people upset they don't win as much as they'd like to in public GAs so they blame it on bots.

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All a botter has to do is adjust the enter times and it's undetected. Those are the real problem. People entering at the same time are more than likely real users and esgst is losing it's mind and has incorrect data. I have no proof on esgst, but there's no reason why someone spending their time to make a bot can't implement any basic bot detection avoidance. It just makes no sense, it shows what a weak argument these people have. Sg would have to give HWID bans but idk how they'd do that.

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And if they perma suspend one, like someone that i don't say the name of, then he come back after 1 year (which is shorter as the lifetime that the hunters invested that he got a perma suspension after the X case) and act like he never done something wrong, is tired about the hunting/writing about the autojoiners and write about autojoiners as they not exist.

I know why i use sg lesser and lesser and why i nearly don't read and write in discussions anymore.
So much wasted lifetime...

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I don't care what groups you join, what are you even talking about. The one I gift the most in has no SG-related rules (not much of a rules at all) and plenty of botters and exploiters. It's a big public group. I'm – at best – in one more-or-less close-knit group and its rules can be summarized to "don't be an ass". I do plenty of public GA's as well. Can you not slander me, please.

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Wasn't talking about you in that regard, my mistake if you understood it that way, was talking about the subject as a whole and how all these bot claimers always say join a group join a group. Which again if a group is going to be public with no restrictions, then there's no way to avoid the same bots that are in public level 0 giveaways already. I replied to him under your comment but went a bit unrelated. Had nothing to do with you, my bad.

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Sometimes this "these people are bots" talk is just user propaganda for people to join private groups and to bait users into having to give there instead, which makes the win ratio much better for those members. I don't think(correct me if I'm wrong) this has to do with duville but this whole bot talk is just people upset they don't win as much as they'd like to in public GAs so they blame it on bots.

This.

Over 10 years and 3300 public giveaways, and I don't have half the problems some of these people claim to have. As quijote said, if you go looking for trouble, that's all you're going to find.

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As a small detail because you weren't able to understand this if it looks.

The DLCs were INCLUDED in the game that each user, that were able to enter the GAs, had at that time.
It don't gave someone that don't owned the DLCs.

So in the best case the users don't checked if they own the DLCs before entering them but with a cost of 50p each (=200p together) is this very unlikely the case for the most ones.

Answer for yourself how many used a autojoiner, that don't care for descriptions or p costs (if not limited with a p setup).

OVER AND OUT

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Suppose I bought the base game on steam, or some other platform, but didn't buy the dlc at the time or ever after. Would I have had all the dlc's for it automatically? Then I don't understand why are there keys for it? This doesn't make sense. I did check and see that the two times I can find it bundled it came with the keys, or as one key idk. What if they got it from ST trading for somehting else and got just the base game?

Also, as for people entering for dlc despite not having the base game, I've done this before and won and had to apologize and ask for a reroll. Why? Because sometimes I'm in a rush gotta leave or don't have much time so I just enter my giveaways and don't got time to open a steam page for everything to check. Heck I have entered in some dlc's now that I have too many points. But for a long time I was hiding every dlc because I couldn't trust them anymore and it was too time consuming for me to open a steam page for so many dlc's and got tired of winning giveaways for a dlc and realize I gotta apologize and ask for a reroll. I just don't like opening steam page for every game. I kinda trust SG which is why I sync my account. I understand that dlc's(some, all?) and some collections don't show up properly due to steam being a pain, so I take my chances sometimes and sometimes I check and blacklist a game, sometimes I just blacklist because the dlc is just dumb anyways.

As for them entering at 50p each again idk, sometimes I just want to use my points fast and go because later I can use points for something else. There's times where I don't even really check what I enter. I see the picture looks alright next. I know some people are really specific with their game lists and their choices and I respect that, but it's not me. I have 400points when I wake up I want to use them and go to work. Or I just get home from work I want to use my points and use some of my time to enjoy. I can't be spending 30 - 40 minutes going through games to see what to enter or have some filtered list of games with like 100000 backlisted games like some do. I don't have that much time and I'd maybe do it if SG was a time management game for me but I don't see it that way.

I mean I don't care for descriptions. Most of the times it's someone begging me to go to their youtube channel/join their discord/ patreon/steam curator/x group and I thought that was against the rules. I thought it was a place to randomly give games not to give games and look for benefits too. If that's the case we should partner with fanatical/humble/indiegala so they give games and we get a huge banner on that page with their link and when you click join it should auto redirect to their site. That would be some profit for the site at least, not for random individuals. I'll admit sometimes when I see a dlc I'll try and pay attention and I see someone who says "I don't care if you enter for the dlc" or someone who says "don't enter if you got the base game" but honestly sometimes I don't got time to check. If it's that upsetting that I win a game where I have the base game, heck ban me or reroll I'll accept it, in a sense they make a public ga for a game that can't be checked due to steam apis.

Again just because theres some botters, doesn't mean it's all, and again, just because you think those are the problem, you have no way to detect those who change their join times even if you want to and there's probably way more of those because it's such an easy thing to add to a bot to make it undetectable. It just makes no sense.

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I don't read more as the first 3 sentences.

The BASE game got upgraded for EVERYONE with ALL DLCs.
So EACH OWNER OF THE GAME HAD ALL DLCs TOO

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Learn to read then cause I went over it. I cant educate you if you're not willing to try and learn. Gotta do your part.

How would they know though? The giveaway page let them enter correct?

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Ofc people warning about bots are suddenly the greedy ones, who can't win enough and not the users who use autojoiners, mental gymanstics much.

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Prosac I'm trying to be nice to you so don't take it wrong, but if you thought about it for a second, there's no reason why a bot would complain about bots in general since it's not designed to do that.

To add more to this, to claim that an overwhelming amount of the userbase is cheating is kinda every losers take in general without being able to provide undeniable proof for it. Pair that with multiple threads over the years from users complaining about their win/loss ratio and you can see how some people want more and more. I mean to be honest, look at the human race, we always want more. Greed defines us, but you could try and control it a little bit.

There's a quote I like that goes like this: "Everyone better than me is a fucking cheater, everyone worse is a fucking loser".

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I have seen some interesting change in number of people joined into a to giveaway on public giveaways that are made to start several days or an entire week in the future. Presumably they skip all the people who only look at very new listings, and probably a lot of bots that sift by time.

Also, it's pretty cheap for a user to reach a level 2 giveaway level, which would sift out a lot of free bots.

6 days ago
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Hmm, that's a good idea to try. But I tend to create giveaways sparsely and on impulse so I would've probably forgotten this tip the next time I'm doing it!

Currently I don't always like to set the level slider, because, well, everyone be it poor students or future giveaway legends has to start somewhere.

5 days ago
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Don't question the will of your robot overlords, meatbag.

6 days ago
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Thanks for the info, but how do I easily deal with this if I only have 1 level?

5 days ago
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Don't worry about it. Too much hassle.

5 days ago
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Public giveaways are giveaways for bots. 95% chance your giveaway just gets eaten by a bot.

If you want to avoid bots, use Group Giveaways. At level 1, you can join Unlucky-7 group and giveaway there. Much less chance of bots there. After Unlucky-7, you can join bigger groups.

https://www.steamgifts.com/discussion/orrR5/unlucky7-a-group-for-those-that-won-7-or-fewer-games-updated-gifter-rules-jan-2024

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This 95% chance is pulled straight from your ass I'm guessing? Or can you provide some data?

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When creating a giveaway, move the "contributor level" slider to level 2, 3, or higher if you're not happy with the results. This will cut out basic bots and auto-joiners.

5 days ago
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You can gift through the community train right now, or post in the quick giveaways/random giveaways thread. Some do jigidis or such and put the link in there and make a new thread. Or just don't worry about it too much.

You can make giveaways at any level, even if you're level 1, if that's your concern.

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I, for one, always check the site using the "New" tab. If many people are like me (and have no life like me, staying at SG a lot of the time :( :( :) ), that means tons of users joining in the first one or two hours.

There is a second peak when the GA is about to end, I imagine because that brings it to the top of the main page.

Other than that, yeah, bots also join GAs as soon as they pop up, I guess.

Cheers!

Edit: actually, reading the other comments.... yeah, a SMART bot would NOT join the GA as soon as it starts.

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A couple of things --

First, while there are certainly bots on this site... the issue you're describing is not necessarily a sign of bots. The main giveaway page shows giveaways in order of their ending time, so when your giveaway has just a few minutes left, it'll be on the front page. And that will usually result in a bunch of people entering... generally all around the same time. Your Color Splash giveaway, for example, ended at 6:54 and there were a ton of giveaways at 6:52 and a few at 6:53. That's not necessarily bots, it's just people seeing the giveaway on the front page.

Second, in my opinion, it's just not worth spending too much mental energy on trying to figure out if your giveaways are going to bots. There are some low-level things you can do, as others have suggested (raise your GA level, join groups and do group giveaways, do invite-only giveaways, etc) but I would just say, try not to spend too much time thinking about bots.

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Autojoiners (Bots) are always the majority of the first 20 entries.

Create 5, low level, public GAs that start at the same time and check it by yourself.
You will see nearly the exact ones, in the same order entered.

I checked the first 25 entries in my public GAs and around the half gone direct to my BL. I always done this when i had time and motivation.

The bots come online in intervalls.
Which means as example each 4h to check for new GAs.
When a lot of Bots do this, with different intervalls on top, then at every time are enough around to have a bunch of accounts that enter each new created GA as "first" or at least fast.
And you see then always the same names of the ones that use the same login intervalls.

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I tried the BL route but it's a waste of time. Just set the minimum level up and try not to look any further!

5 days ago
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Oh i don't do public GAs anymore below lvl 5, if i can't accept that the game go to a cheater. Because every time when i do a public low level GA i regret it and get reminded why i not wanted to do them anymore (i test it 1x/year in average).
But on my BL are only lvl 5 or higher accounts and the BL is anyway full with 1k. So i would need more free spaces.
One of the biggest reasons why i prefer to do GAs for my group or WL.

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CG really should do something about it.
Before it's too late.

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5 days ago
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I kinda assume the botting on this website is probably less than 5% but there's some people who make some crazy claims that it's more without being able to provide any proof, like take masafor for instance, last time I talked to him his data was this at some point, this at some point, and he was the one who claimed to have worked in a group with others and they had reliable data, and yet, it didn't add up. If you see the same people joining multiple giveaways in a row it's likely because they don't have the game, also they might have just opened sg and those two users are active at the same time looking for giveaways. What makes them bots if they both enter two giveaways for games neither own within the same minute?

There's some people who suggest you will get less bots joining a group, I think this is braindead obvious, but that doesn't mean all the public giveaways are bots like the suggest. Think about it, why do you get less bots in a group? Well it requires social interaction, members get denied many times on not having some top 1% profile with high given ratio's for looking sus, and there's more than always a length you have to be on the site for to even join one, and a requirement to give specifically to that group to maintain membership. No botter is gonna spend the time to try and infiltrate your group cause they're not about effort. However you're cutting every single new user out just by asking them to have x months on the site. Then you're cutting everyone who cant' give if they need a ratio. Then you're cutting everyone who's not a top 1% profile because they didn't invest their life savings into steam. So where are those users? They're in public giveaways. Many don't care to interact with you. Heck when you go join a random giveaway website to enter to win a laptop or something, how many of them have comment sections and requirements you make a giveaway for something in return and profiles to look at ratios. Some people just want to enter a giveaway come back later when they earn their points and spend them again. There's the other side of the userbase who wants to trade games within each other in those groups with the pretext of giveaways, you can find like 500 groups doing this atm. That's fine, but it's toxic to say the users who can't or don't give out are bots and if you want to avoid bots you gotta join their fucking pyramid scheme.

Lucky you, you aren't the only person in the world yet. There's 1440 minutes in a day. This means if we only had 1440 daily active users each could come on the site for 1 minute to enter giveaways and come back later. If we just double that to 2880 users, now you can have 2 users for each minute on the site daily, and the same 2 users could enter the same giveaways for an entire minute daily and then leave. If you double that, now it's 5760 users daily active on the site for one minute, and now you got 4 people for each minute on the site. Combine that with other factors like peak times, and some users coming multiple times a day to check for new giveaways and you end up with shrinking minutes and more people during certain other minutes explaining why sometimes you might have 50 people at once joining the same two giveaways. I myself check sg more than 1 time a day just because I cap the points really fast and I got nothing to spend them on, but my library is the fault probably.

TLDR: Just because people join a giveaway within minutes of it's launch doesn't mean they are bots.

5 days ago
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TLDR: You, try to, protect the cheaters as always.

The sg mods seen a lot of data from us, that i, for sure, not show people like you :-D.
Over 100 autojoiners that got suspensions because of our reports of one action (not the only one that we did) say something too.

But you are free to believe whatever fits into your lala land and your agenda.....

5 days ago*
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Prove me wrong. Bring you and your groups data. Lets see it. We talked about this, and you know you got nothing. It's just propaganda for people to enter your pyramid scheme private groups where they have to give something to maintain membership. CG you should move these threads to group recruitment. This is all this bs is.

You cannot prove me wrong. The ratio of bots is not even close to as big as you claim it is. Its impossible for it to be even 25% of what you crazies claim it is. Also, the things you use to claim someone could be botting is easily disproven and you choose to ignore it because you're upset about your win ratio in public GA's.

5 days ago*
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I will not show you data that you could use in a negative way.
I prefer that the data is used to kick more cheaters.

If all my words would be nothing and no data available for some people, then for sure no one would see my group and me as one of the biggest cheater hunters.
I stopped with the hunting nearly 2 years ago. So you don't need to protect your "buddies" so hard and don't need to be so butthurt.

You spread bullshit like "maintain membership with GAs" if you speak from my group.
We never had a rule like "do a monthly GA" and each one that are able to read the group thread see this :o)
You could know this too if you would be able to understand what you read but we know both that your mental capacity are very limited.

OVER AND OUT

5 days ago*
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Lmao that's the same as saying you got no data and again I can prove to you why you are wrong. You are assuming these botters enter instantly. I have a bit of a background in CS so I'll explain why that's even stupid to begin with. Most of who will make bots are amateurs granted, but it's kinda basic you'd want your cheat/hack to be undetected. So what is the first step you'd take to make your bot undetected masafor? You seem to lack the brain cells for this despite all this data and knowledge you got about botting and how it works, so here it is. The first step you take to avoid bot detection is to mess with the join times of the giveaways. What's the point of joining a giveaway instantly when you got 2 days for it to end? There isn't a point, it just makes your bot detectable. No proper botter is going to do this and it would be absolutely undetectable, and if you have enough knowledge to make a bot implementing a timer is like the dumbest thing you'd have to miss out on. Wowzers. Magic I just gave you the answer to life. You're welcome again.

Every time you say something it makes no damn sense. If someone wanted their bot undetectable all they'd have to do is mess with the times. You'd have no way to prove it. This is exactly why in fps games a silent aimbot is harder to detect than a straight up rage bot. Yet, it's stupid effective anyways. Because why aim within a millisecond when you can take 12, and fake human response times. I can guarantee you right now there's tens of bots in your private group using this exact mechanic and you will never find them out because there's no way to do so.

You're actually unbelievable. How can you stand there and make claims about bots and you can't even figure this much out.

There's a reason I ask you for proof, because it's useless. Your proof is dogshit. Who cares if you post it, obfuscate it, whatever. All a botter would have to do is get banned once and then adjust/randomize the enter times and they're out of your view permanently and undetected and you'd kiss their ass for being a real one.

5 days ago*
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You don't need to write anti-detection logic if no one bans you without it since there's no anti-cheat measures in place.

I'm Pro CS. AMA.

5 days ago
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Lets go then. How would you detect/implement detecting someone using a timer on entering giveaways? Something along the lines of having 1000 bots all with a randomized chance between 20 seconds and 2 days to join a giveaway? Good luck.

5 days ago
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You don't need to randomize the time if there's no one watching you though...

5 days ago
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Yet, you're a pro CS guy or whatever lmao. You know for sure not even the most idiot of coders would not forget* implementing a timer to avoid bot detection. So what's the point of not having it? You know how easy it is compared to the rest of the bot. So then, where is your argument standing? You're betting your argument that someone with enough knowledge to make a bot wasn't concerned about any bans despite CG having banned multiple people in the past for this. Weak argument.

Also, I asked you how you'd do it, and yet you evaded the question and responded with nonsense in an AMA. I'd burn your degree and revoke your license. Gotta be joking. Another masafor.

Here's another one for you, if a user can enter more than 1 giveaway a second is that conclusive evidence of bot behavior?

5 days ago*
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CS license lol

If the wolf notices the sheep are unguarded, he doesn't need to be cunning about his attack. Why not use delays? Because it's faster and simpler to code when submitting lots of requests at once, especially depending on how the behavior is implemented.

I would suspect most bots do use delays, and a small number of them don't bother.

5 days ago
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So you're going to tell me that for someone who supposedly makes up about 80%+ of the public giveaways at level 0 and has been going on for years and is so widespread, they haven't had 5 minutes to implement a timer? I seriously don't know if you're joking.

You can literally print the links to the ga to a file along with the post date, randomize a timer to join, and have the bot be sent there to join when it's time and refresh reading the file once every 5 seconds or something. It's not even 5 minutes of coding I have no idea what you're talking about.

Faster and simpler with tons of requests? Sure, that means you didn't implement anything at all, but in 5 minutes you can implement a timer after you spent 1 hour making the bot.

Asked you a second question tho and never got an answer to it. What I'm starting to get is you just don't know. We get it, you can code maybe idk about that maybe share your portfolio and leetcode ? You probably just suck at logically thinking about these problems and solutions.

PS: Why is a CS license funny to you? There's people with bachelor degrees who obviously know nothing. It doesn't matter what you got, no degree or license at all if you can do it. Heck if you can do it without having went 80k in debt to some stupid ass school imo that's sick but that ain't so easy especially when most internships are given to high profile universities.

PS#2: This is why I asked you the first question, not for you to tell me that you suspect most bots use a delay, that's obvious, but that deletes this entire topic because you can't find those people and no one here can. That's why I asked you how you'd go about it, only for you to rant this direction.

5 days ago*
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You probably just suck at logically thinking about these problems and solutions.

Please stop resorting to personal attacks. I am done engaging.

5 days ago
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Good luck to you then. Don't try and prove an argument wrong like I'm the dumbass and then like everyone else provide 0 proof. Take care next time.

PS: Also not a good look to tell anyone you're a CS Pro or laugh at a license, because this is exactly why a hedge fund ends up losing $2 billion in a few seconds for instance. So a 4 year degree school means nothing if they don't teach the right stuff. Also doing an AMA, avoiding my questions, and getting mad at me for being flabbergasted that this just isn't common knowledge even more so to a "Pro" is also not a nice thing to do. Also, last time I argued with masafor about this he said he would be okay banning 150 real users if 30 bots got caught in the wave as well. Keep that in mind when taking his side. That's a big margin of error.

However I get I can be a little toxic when I'm literally amazed at how ridiculous some things can be. Sorry for that. I should try and be more professional but that usually doesn't help anyone.

5 days ago*
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Don't spread lies what i have or had said !

I never said "i would be okay banning 150 real users if 30 bots got caught in the wave as well".

5 days ago*
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True, it was you accusing 400 users you and your group were confident were autojoiners and yet only 150 of them were ever detected for using something. You wanted another 62.5% banned. You were wrong about over 60% of people you accused.

https://www.steamgifts.com/discussion/nrsW7/need-feedback-from-the-moderators-about-spam-comments/search?page=2#xrhhTR3

"You're the one that said it would only be "1,3,5" innocent users that would get incorrectly banned and that is okay to get many botters but then told me out of your 400 certain reports 150 punished only and 250 weren't proven as botters. It's my fault you're off by 62.5%? Like if your data was 99.99% accurate I might've said it's good but still sucks for that one user that did nothing wrong."

https://www.steamgifts.com/go/comment/LiNyY3N

You assumed only 1,3,5 people out of 400 would be innocent, and you were okay with banning even those to catch the rest. Yet you were off by 250 out of 400. You wanted 250 innocents banned to catch 150 bots.

You're right, it wasn't 150 real users for 30 botters, it was 250 real users for 150 botteers. Seems I inflated that data in my memory like you inflate your data but at least I got a link to show for it, you got no proof for yours.. Still 60%+ innocent users would get banned for no reason. This is again according to your private data that you wouldn't share with others and wouldn't want to look into more yourself and you've had time to skew whichever direction you wanted. I used your numbers.

Banning 2 innocent users for every 1 cheater isn't a solution and will never be. Banning 1 user for no reason is again a stupid solution to anything.

5 days ago
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I put you now into my comment filter, that i never see a comment of you anymore.

No internet wannabe bob is worth to have a bad mood and to discuss with you is wasted lifetime, you proofed this many times.
Maybe you are only dumb, don't understand to read messages properly and maybe not understood that you are one of the last ones that we would show our collected data that you could analyze them, but i don't believe that this are the only reasons.

BYE BYE

5 days ago*
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Gottem LMAO! Whoever's reading this(bless your sweet heart and give you something better to do), you can't say I didn't give this blabber or whoever a chance to prove their point. He's had years to prove his point and he never wanted to share his data, never wanted to counter my arguments, never wanted to prove me wrong. Never, just argued endlessly about nothing and switched topics as soon as he realized he was wrong and had nothing to disprove my words. Another one bites the dust.

Oh and masafor, for whenever your filter breaks, take care and I hope you figure it all out.

See ya! EZ..F's in the chat boys and girls.

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5 days ago
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If 150 bots out of 400 users is the norm, that is a substantial percentage of bots. The dispute between the two of you notwithstanding.

5 days ago
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Damn careful masafor's gonna say that's botting.

5 days ago
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Also, take into the account, that we have an option to show new GAs. Myself, I rarely use, just when I have no GAs to spend my points on, but some not-botting folks may use it more often.

5 days ago
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I very rarely see more than a single page's worth of giveaways, and I use ESGST's grid system, so that one page (that is often just 10-15 GAs) is very compact - so when I'm around, I immediately see new giveaways, even ones that end in weeks.

5 days ago
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I mean someone literally posted the link to sorting by new posted above. You could just hit f5 and join that within seconds of it being posted. That will never be evidence for bot behavior.

5 days ago
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Yeah, I've seen that. Wanted to share my example, because I personally don't use the new giveaways page, but I get the same result.

5 days ago
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Hey mate.Yes,there are lots of bots on the site.That's why I recommend you to mask/hide your GAs and create invite-only GAs.There are lots of techniques for that.The most simple is adding something like "NOBOTS" in the GA URL as bot protection. Or you can take a look at this GA of mine where I Marked the GA URL Code Bold.Easy for humans,hard for bots.

5 days ago
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These are rather ineffective protections and can be easily circumvented.

5 days ago
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Are you suggesting it would be hard to make a bot scan forum discussions and read your description to look for certain things like you said, bold letters? There's only 5 bold letters in your text. Wouldn't that be a match they can then test in a link to see if it leads to a giveaway? You could code this for an existing bot in like 30 minutes.

If you want my advice to help against detecting this add some other random bold letters next time. You basically provided the solution. But then all they'd have to do is try combinations or sequences of order found, you could even implement a every second,third,4th, etc bold letter for instance. Kind of a hard game to play. At some point it isn't worthy for them to check anymore.

If you ask me I think all you did was just eliminate a few thousand users who don't go to the discussions at all.

5 days ago
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5 days ago
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Closed 5 days ago by MaxonKlaxon.