Which is more important?
Great idea. The first thought I had was about the “why didn’t my cv increase” threads too. I honestly feel that raw cv isn’t a very helpful piece of information anyway
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Personally, I see the idea of showing Real CV by default as a great idea, however, I think the real issue is in the need for clarification of those values as the reason why we see so many threads about “why didn’t my cv increase” and "why did my level drop?", and I for one don't think it will resolve that.
But definitely, I think the default CV view should change 👍🏼
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It's explained in the FAQ in the Contributor Value and Levels section, but there is a lot of text in that section and many people may not read it.
This is at the end after it explains how full, reduced, and no value giveaways work.
If you hover over the number of gifts, you would see you have one "No Value" gift, one "Reduced Value", and one "Full Value". If you hover over the dollar value, you would see you have a contributor value of $53. It would be calculated as 0% of the gift with no value (0 x $10.00 = $0.00) + 15% of the gift with reduced value (0.15 x $20.00 = $3.00) + 100% of the gift with full value ($50.00)
Edit: What would be a really good idea would be to make people more aware that the FAQ exists. Now that there is a help section of the discussions, when you go to the page to create a new discussion and you choose the "help" category, there should be a little highlighted section of text that shows up on the page that says something like: "If you have any questions about how the site works, please check the FAQ page before creating a new thread. You can find the answer to almost all questions there."
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Yup totally agree it is written in the FAQ, but who reads that :P
I feel the default profile page is lacking information that the average user can understand without referring to said FAQ. Even after reading the FAQ the first time, it took me a bit to work out why I didn't get my Full CV. I still often wonder why my CV keeps dropping even though all the games I give away have already got reduced CV added. 🤷🏼♀️
The change Mully suggests is good for those of us who understand the system already, but not necessarily gonna stop those random threads.
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CV is always calculated based on the current full US Steam retail price, not the price when you created the giveaway. If you give away a $60 game that has been bundled, you will get 15% of $60 which is $9 real CV. If that game in the future drops to $40, now your CV is calculated based on $40 which would be $6 bundled value. Temporary sales do not affect CV, just the current full retail price. If a game is removed from Steam, SG calculates based on the last know price.
If you give away a lot of high value giveaways, you will lose more CV over time than someone who gives away lower valued games because the high value games are more likely to reduce their full retail price over time while the cheaper games are probably not going to be reduced much, if at all.
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You’re preaching to the choir mate. I never said I don’t understand it, it’s just impossible to track it ;-)
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I agree. I only care about seeing the real CV value which means I have to mouse over every time I want to see the number on a profile. I think most people care more about seeing real CV, so it would make sense to show that as the main number.
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Agreed, it makes more sense to show real CV since that's what levels are based on.
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Ratio is won/sent (raw / real). Its good to have ratio >1
ESGST thread
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Not in all cases. You can calculate ratio for:
sent games / won games - here they count, as free games are still sent or won
Sent raw CV / won raw CV - here they also count, hence the "it shows $80 but I'm level 0" complaints
Sent real CV / Won real CV - they are 0 CV, they don't matter
You can't mix them, as they calculated by different methods, despite they are all in USD.
edited because I don't really check raw CV and I wrote stupid stuff
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No. Only leeching hurt your ratio. Once again
6.46 is 963 sent / 149 won games
3.43 is comparing sent/won base steam prices (raw)
1.69 is comparing their reduced prices (real)
Giving away free games just hurting difference between your raw and real CV
sgtools
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Agreed. Thinking about it - neither sent games, nor raw CV has any correlation with levels. No wonder some new users are confused that two of their three stats are growing, but the one that matters - level - is not.
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Or just hide everything and maybe people will be nicer with each other :D.
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I agree with it. Raw CV doesn't give useful information at all. I say raw CV shouldn't be visible at all. Why confuse people by providing 2 different values, when one of them is not relevant to anything at all.
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If it will limit number of "I have 500CV and only 1 level" tickets, then I agree :eyes:
Now we need to direct people to SGtools and FAQ to show why their "500CV" is in fact 10CV. Without RAW CV visible (or just on hover over) people would not think every given game gives them 20 / 40 / 50CV.
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Yeah, probably like https://www.steamgifts.com/discussion/q7GQb/swap-raw-contributor-value-with-real-cv#CkrXPCs if possible. More info is better than less info. :3
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then we will just get "why is my CV not growing" threads.
the real problem here is that half of the content on ones profile is hidden away behind mouse over content which is anything but intuitive.
why of course this is also explained in the FAQ... we know that those posts come from ppl that dont read it anyway.
so while ESGST can enable for all this info to be displayed all at once, it is new members (who dont have ESGST yet) who ask this.
so i guess the only solution would be to make all those stats to be visible.
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If this is mostly about why didn't my CV increase threads, then I think a better solution would be to update the Create a new GA page. Currently it only shows a static text:
- Reduced value towards your contributor level.
** No value towards your contributor level.
It could be updated with some text that reacts to the CV of the GA.
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Thanks for pointing that out. I've enabled it to see how it works, but I'm not that interested in RCV myself.
The point I wanted to make was more about the experience of those at the start of their SG career. At that point I'm generalizing here, so bear with me when you make your first GA, you're only interested in increasing your level. I think it would be beneficial, after you've selected the game, to just to see plainly stated the effect the GA will have on you level. What you would see could be one of three things:
- By gifting this full value game your level will increase from x to y;
- By gifting this reduced value game your level will increase from x to y;
- By gifting this game your level will not increase, because at some point this game was given away for free;
The first 2 points would need the caveat that they only hold true as long as the price of the game does not change. I don't think we want to open that can of worms. So I guess this was a nice thought experiment. It's probably best not to implement this. 🙂
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they should just make everybody level 10 by default, cause if everybody is level 10, no one is
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYmHYQPaHaw back when my name is earl was a super villain
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I like this idea. It may also serve another purpose in quieting some of the "giveaway bullying" that goes on around here by "generous" users farming won:sent and feeling entitled to talk down to other users.
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That's a really good idea, I'm surprised it hasn't been suggested before now.
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Title says it all. Swap the info in the raw contributor value field with the one in the rollover popup so the latter is always visible next to the won and sent numbers.
The raw value of sent games is useless when you calculate levels by applying other variables, such as 0% for free games and 15% for bundles. Its only purpose is to make people feel good.
Having raw cv visible confuses people and we end up with a bunch of "Why didn't my LV increase?" threads. Not that swapping values would prevent people from creating these threads... but at least some could see they have 0cv.
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