How are they stealing it, if it's not exclusive? ^^
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Yet at least, but you know what they say about giving a devil your finger.
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That he will start counting the days til you wind up in hell so he can do unspeakable things to you in retaliation?
Last thing i want is to call epic "daddy" so count me out of this.
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"...you know what they say about giving a devil your finger."
A crazy-ass good time?
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Let me guess, you still go on Epic for having a free good game a week but scream if something is not Steam exclusive right ? Right.
Wonder who is the devil there :)
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Epic "steals" making deal with developers that own the game = BAD
Pirating epic exclusives = Totally not stealing, the pirate is an hero, GOOD
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The Epic Games Store will be our exclusive third-party PC download partner (you will still be able to directly download the game from MTGArena.com).
It is somewhat exclusive. It is unclear however whether Epic paid them off to be the only one to distribute the game outside of the developer's site.
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Sure, it is exclusive as far as distribution platforms go, and that might very well be a legal agreement, if we go by what Epic did lately. I was just referring to the OP that stated "At least it's not exclusive". ;)
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You're right, but they pulled exclusivity with Dauntless. Which must've sure felt great for people who bought supporter packs before launch.
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We are thrilled to be partnering with Epic to expand Magic's reach to new gamers from around the world. The Epic Games Store will be our exclusive third-party PC download partner (you will still be able to directly download the game from MTGArena.com).
Not exactly what one would call an exclusive... Though, a third party exclusive is still a third party exclusive. Epic most certainly paid for this. There's no reason they wouldn't expand to the biggest video game storefront if they truly were planning to expand the accessibility of the game.
While not a complete exclusive, it's still an exclusivity deal. Luckily the game's still available from the original site, so the backlash shouldn't be as big. I dislike Epic a lot these days. I wonder if the fact that it's still available on the original site is because Epic wanted to give users more options or because the publisher didn't play ball with them enough. While this is still very anti-consumer if they got poached by Epic, I'm not against developers/publishers voluntarily picking a single storefront to be in.
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The epic launcher might actually be an improvement over Wizards's launcher.
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What launcher would that be, desktop? Where I launch all my games instead of going to some crappy launcher program where they are much harder to find?
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Steam is still a launcher program though. Granted you can great a shortcut, but it still is a launcher program.
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You don't need to use the Epic launcher. Epic exclusive games have so far been DRM free, you can just make a desktop shortcut and go. You can download and install the game, uninstall the Epic launcher entirely, and the game will still work. That's one area where Epic is strictly better than Steam, and almost as good as GOG.
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That's one area where Epic is strictly better than Steam, and almost as good as GOG.
Valve don't force DRM requirement's so any game on Steam that isn't DRM-freebus because the publisher chose not to make it available as such. You could argue that Steam are in fact the best option here for providing the choice.
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I'm not sure how leaving it up to the DRM-loving publishers is the best option, unless you mean the best option for the publishers. For consumers the best option is just taking a stance and telling the publishers that the games on your store will be DRM free.
GOG is clearly the best option when it comes to DRM, with Epic being a close second. But don't worry, Steam can still lord it over Origin and Uplay.
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I've seen people saying this, but I have a question: how would you back up a game that came through Epic? GOG has the installers that you can download, and Humble/itch usually sell either an installer or a compressed folder with all of the stuff in it, but Epic is only downloaded and installed through the launcher, as far as I can tell. Copying a game folder and moving it to another computer doesn't always work, either, because the installation process often configures certain files to the computer it's on and the folder it's going to be in.
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I don't know if you can. Some games are self-contained, such that you can just copy the folder over, but for any game that doesn't support that you'd probably need to use the launcher to download and install the game.
It's certainly not ideal for installing games on a PC with no internet access, the way that you can with GOG games. But you can't do that with Steam either - only GOG, itch.io, and DRM-free games on Humble offer that option that I know of.
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I was wondering about that. To me, it isn't really DRM-free if it's not portable or able to be backed up. There are even a lot of console games that aren't DRM-free, because you need an internet connection to play them, and when those servers go down, all you're left with is a rather ineffective paperweight. It's the same thing that I really don't like about Steam - and I know I'm in the wrong place to be saying that - but that's why I don't even wishlist games on Steam if I can get them from GOG or itch, or DRM-free from Humble. I'm old-fashioned, and I like owning the things that I buy. Now, I do know that Steam has an option to back up your games, but I don't know all that that entails or what you can do with it, and hard drive space is at a premium for me right now, so I can't play around with it just yet.
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I totally understand where you're coming from. GOG is usually my preference too, or DRM-free from Humble.
All of my family computers are always connected, so I'm still pretty happy that the Epic games are DRM-free once installed so they can be installed on each computer without the limitations that Steam places upon Family Sharing.
I didn't realize Steam even had a back up option, and I have no idea how it works. I've obviously never tried it.
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Most likely a % of all in game purchases for all users through epic. Wasn't too impressed with MTGA due to no trading. It is a CCG like Hearthstone.
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... What dose the price you pay for something have to do with whether on not someone can steal it from you?
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Price is irrelevant. The only requirement for stealing is for someone to have something someone else used to have but no longer has, because it was taken for him.
For example
If Fred gives Bob an ice cream cone but Joe takes it from him. then Joe has stolen Bob's Ice Cream. The fact that Bob got the icecream from Fred for no cost doesn't negate that theft, nore does it make the ice cream cone "nothing to steal"
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As I understand it, MTG:A was only available from the Wizards site, and now it will also be available from Epic. Hardly 'stealing'.
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+1.
Actually, if they cared, I believe, that OP could be sued for this statement.
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Maybe if they lived In some 3rd world country run by lawyers. But not In reality.
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there's a difference between can and will.
Yes, the OP could be sued for the statement. No, it will never happen.
There is no financial harm coming from the statement, so the best-case result would be an injunction and a take-down order.
The cost to do so would literally be tens of thousands of dollars.
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So, by this logic, Steam also stole Final Fantasy XIV, because it used to be the only third-party store that had the launcher beyond the native one over Square/the game's site? 🤔
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No no, if it's on Steam I can spend money on it for free without spending any real money. If it's only on a Chinese spyware site, it's unusable thus stolen from me with absolutely no added benefits.
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woot, but to be honest, you cant just throw something into a room wihtout any proof. thats not how it works.
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I'm not sure by this point if you know or not that Starwhite was fooling around all the time. ;)
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S. if you make accusations, the burden of proof is on you, not the other way round.
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That's what a Chinese spyware pusher would say.
Err... are we going here from abusing Epic to abusing fellow SG members, if they don't agree with you???
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No? They arent pushing it, just taking what the pusher says as a fact.
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By other news, Origin and uPlay are stealing games from Steam!!!44!4!
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My surprise is not waning, not even after a whole month! :O
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Well Origin did steam my Dragon Age game from Steam, along with all the other games I had on Steam that were then on Origin.
I fired up Steam to play, and it was gone!
I got a notice that I had to go to Origin to play!
Sure enough, it was now on Origin, something I'd totally avoided using up to that point.
No warning, no choice, just one day it was gone from my account, and that's what pissed me off.
Funny though... I didn't hear anyone on the forums screaming bloody murder over that, and it seemed like I was the only one upset.
Kind of hypocritical of those same people that said nothing over that, but are now screaming at Epic for lesser issues.
Eventually the company relented on forcing all there stuff to be exclusively on Origin since even with that stranglehold, almost nobody would buy hardly anything on Origin. Maybe that will happen with Epic as well, but I wouldn't make a bet on that right no as they seem to be doing pretty good. Besides, the situations are only somewhat similar, there are some rather significant differences.
Either way, we'll see what happens.
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If you mean this, then it was Valve who forced them out of Steam because the game had in-app purchases:
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-07-28-ea-valve-removed-steam-dragon-age-ii
Evidently, since then they went back on that, considering Valve games are now full of in-app purchases… Or, more precisely, they went back on it as long as they get at least 10% cut of the in-app purchases.
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Thanks for that info. At the time I couldn't find anything that said why, so I just guessed that they'd pulled their stuff and put it on their own Origin store so they didn't have to pay Steam a cut.
It would have been nice if Steam would have mentioned this stuff, but somehow it doesn't surprise me these days that they didn't.
Good to finally know what really happened :)
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Stupid Steam, stealing our games and giving them to Origin! Down with Steam, I say! Who's with me?
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There were plenty of us pissed at the inclusion of an Origin installer (via the EA Update Client) in our games that had previously not required it. I mean, back then half the games weren't even on Steam but it still pissed us off, because Origin had a bad start with its EULA asking for non-specific rights to your data. That lack of specificity in what it collects, where it goes, and for what reasons, actually made me boycott a thing for the first time in my life. Which sucked major ass because I has hungry for Mass Effect 3 and Battlefield 3.
Once they adjusted it, I still didn't have much trust for them so just kept the holding pattern. Vote with the wallet, etc.
I eventually ended up agreeing to said EULA by accident when I played Darkspore, not realising that despite being available through Steam, they applied the Origin EULA through it. To punish the end of my boycott, upon first installing Origin and encountering an error, as it cleaned up the install operation, it deleted the parent directory too (which was my C:/games/). I only realised because I left the uninstaller as it seemed to have hanged doing something, but realised my HDD had been chugging for a long time. It had eaten all the way up to Skyrim in my steam folder (and devoured 95% of the other non-steam folders too). No way to prove it, and would just be met with assumptions of being a clumsy first-time PC user, despite no file transfer dialogues and only winamp and a stuck-busy original installer. I lost my favourite Toribash replays, a bunch of awesome saves from a roguelike, my dwarf fortress projects, everything. I never had the heart to try playing Skyrim again after all the time I spent browsing, downloading and then setting up mods. To make matters worse, my internet connection was terrible (350kb/ps download) and I live in a place that has one of the last functioning municipal phone systems in the UK, meaning no alternate ISPs.
Okay, shit, sorry, big tangent. My war story, haha.
Origin got PLENTY of backlash for the things they got wrong. Their client would randomly drop upwards of 8 gigs of download progress on games at random, repeatingly, and their 'solution' was to enable downloads for the beta version of the client. That remained their main fix to that one same problem for several years. I shit you not. However EA were entirely within their rights to put their owned properties on their own launcher. There was no reason for them to give such a big slice of money to Valve, so they can't be faulted for that. Just everything else that sucked around it, haha. Origin gradually shaped up to be tolerable though, but to offset their strong customer support (aside from my deceased games folder!) their sales are normally a lot weaker and they have a bad DLC release/pricing ethic (lookin at you, Sims!).
I'm just gonna be over here being silently thankful I changed the origin install directory to be under my /games/ instead of the default of /program files/. Eesh. I can't even begin to fathom what kind of thing went down to let that happen though. You'd hope there would be a permissions/access system to prevent that kind of activity? I don't know the fineprint of the Win7 UAC but... something? I dunno?
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i'm just a gamer,not a dev and i had 0 know about software\sales\stores\business
but i think this...
if who create the game:
-use the Unreal Engine 4 (owned by Epic)
-must to PAY MONEY to Epic for use the Engine
if Epic
-propose to the creator of the game to make it exclusive for epic store and in Exchange Epic give to the creator of the game freedom to NOT PAY the use of the UE4 but instead get a little % on sales revenue
So then i think is possible that some devs (not all) choose to publish their F2P games in exclusive for epic instead of all other stores because would be for they a good deal (in the economic\money\business side and not about Love\Passion for videogames\community or humans valors ) to do it exclusive for epic,by do this avoid expensive costs of publish&engine license at start and earn money after.
But this is just my idea as a gamer with 0 know about all these things,for sure i'm wrong i dont know...
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That's a thing already. Devs who use UE don't have to pay royalties for copies sold on the Epic store.
Whether that's attractive will depend on the devs. Assuming that the devs still use their own servers for the games, what Epic basically offers is more exposure and some saving on game downloads.
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This is actually a good thing.
More exposure for the game, and it isn't exclusive to Epic as it's available from its original point of download. This is more an 'exclusive growth' deal where it appears there had been no significant plans to offer the game elsewhere, so nobody is burnt in the process and the property being acquired also benefits. If Epic focused on this form of acquisition the soreness of people towards them would be waaaaaay less.
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Epic is getting good ... the chinese spyware claims were proven void - if they keep
up the pace, it'll be a real alternative to steam in no time, if not already.
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what the hell is Magic even? Some chinese knockoff Hearthstone?
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lol
Magic The Gathering is probably the main ancestor and the most famous of all CCGs. It existed (in paper cards) before the pokemon CCG, before Heartsone and before Internet arrives in our homes. Heatstone if a more a knockoff of MTG than the contrary...
And I found no hints indicating that this specific game, MTG Arena, could have been developed by some chinese devs. To me it seems to be an 100% american product.
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hmm...doubt its any better than Duel Masters
yugioh player here...i like pissing off magic fans
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^^ I'm not a fan though. I have not played MTG for years, and I have never touched their online games (yet).
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Oh boy, this reminds me when people were accusing of Dr. Doom being a Darth Vader rip-off when the first Fantastic Four movie came out…
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At least it's not exclusive, I'd rather go back to Hearthstone than start making accounts at some Chinese spyware site to play MTG.
I find the sentence pretty funny. Ask someone on Team 5 when they plan on releasing Hearthstone on Steam.
As for MTG Arena, I've been playing before launch and I was pretty ecstatic when I saw the announcement the other day as I've been wondering when a move to a mainstream client was going to happen. For me it doesn't matter if the game goes to Steam or the Epic Games Store as I use both clients.
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Epic this Epic that - There is shit inside my hat
Ladi da Ladi do Ladididii23¤"#¤"%T5t
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good, move that arena trash to epic and isolate it from real mtg.
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If it came to Steam I could make giveaways for Magic cards here. So they stole those gifts from everyone who plays MTGA here.
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That's because Steam offers much better service to the end consumer. I also don't recall a case when Valve would pulled some exclusive deal like that. As far as I know, publishers of f2p who are distributing their game trough Steam did that as a business decision (because Steam is attractive to publishers even without a bag of money), which in some cases saved games that would easily died if they wouldn't (Warframe).
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Epic is so bad! They twisted the arms of Wizards of the Coast and Pheonix Labs to Steal MTG Arena and Dauntless!! lol
The launch of MTG Arena along with Throne of Eldraine and an event where you could win every card is standard incoming in 5 days! Can't wait!
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Not to forget the 10 rare+ renewal rewards. Wait, Epyx is the worst!
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Since open beta when Guilds came out.
So I was in the last sweet spot to start playing and got most of all cards that are not rotating out now for free.
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I had access before that but when I found out that there was going to be a reset I didn't bother actually playing much. I did get some lands from Mirage, Amonkhet, Rise of Eldrazi lands as a reward. I also have some MTG Arena exclusive lands, but I don't remember if it came with those or I got them from an event or somewhere else.
Did you play real cards? Any MTG digital before MTGA?
I started with real cards back in '93 with Unlimited and played till the Kamigawa block in 2005. After that I went to digital with Magic Duels on Steam in 2015(I think I actually played before it was released but not positive) and played that till around early 2017 before they released Amonket. Even with me playing both Magic Duels and MTG Arena I still never got to play with cards from Amanket or Hours of Devastation.
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Never played any real cards, but I learned all about the economy when I bought a card board box full of them for 8€ and sold starter packs to some kids for 10-20€ each. Only digital before Arena was https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic:_The_Gathering_(1997_video_game)
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Sounds like you made a nice profit. :)
I just looked up MTG 1997 on youtube and it looks really familiar. I might of played it but not sure. I just remembered I played MTG Battlegrounds for the Xbox back in 2003. I thought the game was pretty kool because when you cast something it would show a visual representation. So if you cast a Air Elemental it would send out a creature to cross the battlefield and attack your opponent.
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I just wanted to take a moment to mention for anyone who may be interested in playing MTG Arena that you don't have to use the Epic Game Store ever to play the game. You can download MTG Arena at MTGArena.com and play the game on it's own client.
They also have some really nice rewards if you create an account before September 26th.
Here's some info https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/magic-digital/mtg-arena-state-game-september-20-2019
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It's in the link above right near the top of the article under the "GIANT OPPORTUNITY" heading.
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Oh, that's way less epic than I thought it would be...
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Really? It costs nothing to participate. Win 12 matches and you get a copy of every card in standard.. that's 1,323 cards, a sealed deck token and a 1 time card back exclusive to this event.
Even winning 11 matches gets you a full set of the new expansion plus the sealed deck token and the card back.
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You have to win 12 matches, you may only lose twice and you have only ONE shot at this. The chance that you even get to 11 wins is less that 0.01%.
Also you only get 1 copy of each card. So you still have to get the other 3 copies of the cards the old fashioned way.
So yeah, way less epic than it sounds...
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Less than 0.01%? Don't get me wrong it's going to be hard but I don't even think going 12 wins is that low of a percent. There's plenty of people who win 7-0 in current tournaments.
Yes you will still need to get however many copies you need to 4 of each but a full set of every card is a great prize for a free event. It's not supposed to be easy or something the majority of people can do, it's suppose to be a big challenge.
How long have you been playing MTG Arena?
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Since Dominara, Ixalan and Rivals of Ixalan, Aka: CBT. So yeah...
Also going 7-0 in Drafts is totally different than going 7-0 in constructed.
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Each has their own type of difficulty. There's people who go undefeated in several constructed tournaments as well.
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Just don't lose and win everything, sounds simple and only bad for losers.
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not sad :)
Nowadays everybody is a hater if he dislikes something .
i guess the revolution was a foundation of haters :)
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Yea fuck people and their voiced opinions. Why they cannot just shut up and consume.
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Nothing wrong with having an opinion because that's what makes everything more interesting. Epic regardless of if people dislike them or not have given away a lot of good games and as a result it's good to see people open to playing them as well as trying out their launcher store. At the end of the day competition is good for us all :)
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Really? If it would become exclusively availble on Steam, nobody would mind. Now it's not even exclusively available, but ALSO available on Epic and all hell breaks loose.
Get a life people!
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That's because Steam offers much better service. I also don't recall a case when Valve would pulled some exclusive deal like that. As far as I know, publishers of f2p who are distributing their game trough Steam did that as a business decision (because Steam is attractive to publishers even without a bag of money), which in some cases saved games that would easily died if they wouldn't (Warframe).
And what do you mean by "get a life"? Are people with principles and opinions now called no-lifers? What a sad time we live in.
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Because people get angry about something they don't even need to use! It was available via their own site, it's still available via their own site. No need to use Epic, no need to have an Epic account.
There are way better things to actually get upset about than something you don't even need to use!
(Still don't know why you mention "principles and opinions". because YOU DON'T NEED TO USE THE EPIC STORE! So if your principle is to avoid Epic you still can. If you played the game before - just keep doing it. If you want to play it now that it becomes available through the Epic store - why get all worked up about it? You can still go to their own website.)
Valve started the digital business - so why would it have needed exclusives? It's always had a monopoly position, so why would it have needed exclusives? Or otherwise: a LOT of what's on there isn't available anywhere else - so can we count that as exclusives?
And the big one: The Witcher 3 is available on Steam. But Valve's games aren't available on GOG. So why doesn't Valve allow other stores to carry their games?
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Steam was effectively the ONLY online distributor available. By default, they were often de facto exclusive deals.
The other online distributors are either company stores, or niche product stores.
Good Old Games is actually both. They are niche product because of their old titles, and also company store for CD Projekt.
Origin, Uplay, and many others are just company stores. Uplay is Ubisoft, while Origin is EA.
You may not like Epic playing hardball with Steam, but do you think Steam taking 30% just to distribute wasn't a strongarm towards the game creators?
Of course, nobody is making you or anyone else use Epic. Conversely, the only one preventing you from using it is yourself.
It's not like the 30 seconds it takes to download the client is a burden on the consumer. Nor is the time to actually open it up a burden on the consumer. It's just your choice.
Of course choice is great, but don't think that Steam only in the market is a choice, that's just a monopoly.
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Steam was never the ONLY online distributor available. It was the ONLY one successful. But those games you're talking (I presume you're talking about pre-Origin/Uplay/GoG era, since you mentioned them) about were still sold in retail and didn't need Steam to run (except of course, games by Valve). Publishers only started to use Steam as an exclusive platform by the time Steam userbase was so huge it was more profitable for them to sell there, as the 30% was eventually better way than expensive retail distribution. And yes, nowadays Steam has some exclusive titles, but they are exclusives only because the publishers simply don't need or want distribute anywhere else, they are not hold by any contract, therefore there's no exclusivity deals outside of Valve's own production.
And no, I don't think 30% was strongarm towards game creators. Compare indie scene before and after Steam. Or whole PC gaming scene. I don't think Steam hurt any of that, au contraire. Yet I do think that what is Epic doing is in fact hurting both developers and consumers. And strongarm towards big publishers like EA or Activision? Yeah, I'm okay with that.
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It isn't even an exclusive. You can still get it through direct download, exactly the same as before. I don't really like the way Epic is going about things, but there's no foul play here.
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You're every bit as bad as they are, let's not pretend otherwise.
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I don't need to reply to every comment to make a point.
Those supporting EGS have become worse than those who dislike the service, at least around here.
More Epic haters - what sad people :)
Get a life people!
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sTeAm GoOd
Nah. The people going full ham on Epic tend to be just as openly pissy towards Steam too.
As much as you're trying to mock it, what you're doing in this very reply is an equal part of the very same "typical gamer mentality". It's always easy to tear things down, especially when misportrayed.
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People here were more than happy to declare Valve 'literally actually probably genuine satan-spawn' when they stopped letting gift purchases be stored in inventories, or changed specifics in sales, or added marketplace wait times, mobile authentication, or attempted to let modders sell their own content, etc.
The hyperbolic anger at steam has subsided temporarily now that another platform has done something more pronouncedly questionable. Once Epic catches up to other basic storefronts in features (basket / search function), irons out their hiccups and hopefully gets a grip on their PR / aggressive buyout strategies, then the slapstick gamer-rage will go back into stalking-predator mode, waiting to pounce on some other morsel until a subject of any actual remote immoral or cruddy behaviour crops up.
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Nevermind that those people might have actual, legitimate reasons for not liking EGS (or other launchers).
Speaking personally, I simply won't spend a dime on their store until they give me what I want in regards to service, features, and price.
It's like that anywhere I shop, online or otherwise. Somehow, though, I manage to get my point across without "shit-posting" or insulting other users.
I know, I know. I'm a terrible person for expecting to get what I want for my money. "REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE."
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What do you think about Steam locking people out of the marketplace for getting their games from bundles and gifts?
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It's been common knowledge since the marketplace was added that you can't use it without a purchase within the last year.
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Not wanting to buy things through another launcher isn't 'shitting on' the competition, though. It's a matter of convenience of having them all in once place. All the stuff padded around that with unnecessary bitterness or without a grounded reason might be, but not opting to buy non-exclusives only on a central platform. When a product has enough merit, typically in a strong franchise such as Battlefield, The Sims, Grand Theft Auto, Rainbow Six Siege, Overwatch, Warcraft, etc then people buy into it with only momentary griping. Not out of brand loyalty, but in being creatures of habit and wanting convenience.
In an ideal world, Valve would have to make a decision on what it wants to be actual exclusives to its platform, and they along with other businesses would have non-exclusive properties have sales act as a kind of 'global license' that could be downloaded outside of the client. Though cross-platform licenses become tricky as one business ends up having to field the server strain for a profit made by someone else, and a floating DRM midpoint without its own business interests is unrealistic.
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Here's something that we never should forget, Mei from Overwatch is the most devoted supporter of freedom for Hong Kong.
Mei also knows that Taiwan is the real China, the other one is a mongol impostor.
https://youtu.be/wt9_6lE2UTo?t=891
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