A good comment/entry ratio, my profile as an example
It is my belief that this only encourages people to use spam thanks-scripts for giveaways. They contribute nothing genuine to the conversation, and make any real comments harder to find. So, it's not just without value, but in fact detrimental. And this is something that private groups with high comment ratio requirements encourage!
To me, commenting in the forum has infinitely more value. No thanks-scripts mucking up the place, AND you can easily see replies (Account | View Replies, from the top of any page). Check my account; the majority of my comments have been made here in the forums, rather than on giveaway pages. Without an efficient way to see replies, it is difficult to leave something meaningful on each one.
That is my opinion, but opinions vary. I have even seen people who appreciate the thanks-scripts, a concept I cannot quite wrap my mind around.
While I would love to be part of a genuine community, I fear that as long as you and I differ so greatly on the value of empty thanks-comments, it will remain an impossibility. Or perhaps SteamGifts will come up with an improved comment system, and everyone might live in harmony after all.
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It is though, as comments in the forum (the community) are indistinguishable from comments auto-generated by a script in giveaways.
Without a way to tell them apart, someone who uses a thanks-script will appear to be an active part of the community, even while never setting foot in the forum.
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Except that it's not at all.
We don't want 1:1, we want it substantially higher, ideally. Someone would have to make their script thank repeatedly on giveaways to achieve that.
Frankly, I would look askance less at someone whose ratio was a little less than 1 than someone whose ratio was close to or a little over.
Also, total number of comments and the length of time registered factor in more heavily than the ratio, although, to be honest, pretty much everything is factored in more than the ratio. It's not even that important. I invite people with 'unsatisfactory' ratios all the time.
Decent attempt at derailing the thread into a traditional 'thanks' argument, but poor execution. 3/10
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We don't want 1:1, we want it substantially higher, ideally.
So, more comments than entries. See, with a thanks-script, that's easy. Each entry has the auto-generated "comment", plus any comments they make in the forum. That makes it substantially higher, just like you want.
Someone would have to make their script thank repeatedly on giveaways to achieve that.
No they wouldn't, for the reasons I just pointed out. You're being ridiculous, haha.
Frankly, I would look askance less at someone whose ratio was a little less than 1 than someone whose ratio was close to or a little over.
So, ideally someone who entered some giveaways before discovering the auto-thanks scripts? Got it.
Decent attempt at derailing the thread into a traditional 'thanks' argument, but poor execution. 3/10
I'm not trying to derail anything, and that's an insulting thing to say. Don't resort to logical fallacies just because you can't think of a proper argument. It would be more respectful to not respond at all, which I feel is the next step.
My argument hasn't changed, and you haven't refuted it. Asking for high comment/entry ratios encourages auto-thanks scripts. Of course it does, how can it not? Auto-thanks scripts make it EASIER to maintain a high comment/entry ratio. <-THIS IS THE PART YOU HAVEN'T ANSWERED
If Steamgifts tracked giveaway replies like it does forum replies, there would be a reason to post comments there. Even better, if Steamgifts had a Thanks button for giveaways they could be separated from the comments. Steamgifts has neither of these things yet, so at this time, encouraging high comment ratios encourages auto-thanks scripts, to the detriment of the site.
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Scripts are irrelevant to what I'm saying. What you're telling me is basically that your argument is that it's possible for people to make scripts to automatically comment. That's not an argument. That's an obvious fact.
What I'm saying is that we want to see people who are clearly interested and involved in the community. Unless people have scripts to make multiple comments on each giveaway (which will result in a suspension), having comments well above entries is a good rough indicator of that.
If someone has been here 4 months and has 3,000 entries with only a few dozen comments, it's a pretty safe bet they're not interested in participating in the community and are all about 'phr33 gaems pl0x.' If someone here a similar length of time has a few hundred entries and 4,000 comments, it's generally a reasonable assumption that they are genuinely active and participating in the community. These are fairly extreme examples, and, frankly, obvious. I shouldn't have to explain that.
Of course, this is all glossing over the stronger argument here. You seem to be deliberately ignoring the penultimate section of the OP, which I personally authored. As it states, these are not at all hard-and-fast requirements, but guidelines that we use to help sort through applications, and, as I said before, the ratio is probably the least important thing listed.
You also keep talking about how the site should do this and that, and support is the place for suggestions. And since you're mentioning logical fallacies, you have yet to say one thing that demonstrates how you or anyone else is in any way harmed by the use of scripts in the first place, instead treating it as a given. You have an enormous burden of proof to overcome there before you have the slightest case whatsoever.
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How does your "thanks-script" applies to that god's sake!
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Oh my! I apologize for causing you to use BOLD TEXT. My intention was to point out that any requirement that members of private giveaways must have certain comment ratios will inevitably lead to the use of thanks-scripts. Not by everyone, of course, but by some.
What is really needed is for Steamgifts to separate the two, or not count giveaway comments at all. Then there would be no problem.
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I meet all requirements except the Contributor Value, you wrote that you can be flexible with it and i would be really happy to be a part of the group!
Can i join?
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I'd like to join. My comment to entry ratio isn't anything super amazing but that's because I don't like to "Thanks" spam every giveaway. I usually only leave a comment if I have something semi-interesting to say. Most of my comments are from the forum.
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Most of my comments are also from the forum, so that's an answer for you ;)
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Based on TheSnake's "...so that's an answer for you ;)" I assumed he was rejecting my "application" because of my entry:comment ratio. I was just pointing out that purely looking at entry:comment ratio is a very poor indicator of activity. Comments/time isn't much better but I do think that it's slightly better than than the comment:entry ratio. Anyway, I don't really care about whether or not I'm accepted into this particular group I'm just trying to encourage better metrics when making decisions.
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Im interested in joining. Wait, what do you mean it isn't actually named VIP Private Public Best SG Group? I'll have to get back to you on that... :p
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Yes....excellent....now follow him around the forums repeating this :-D.
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I am interested in the creative contest(Mostly into photography and poetry a tiny bit, my poetry turns out depressing usually though...) part and gaming together, not much into TF2 but am up for most other games.
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But shes my future wife :-(.
Thanks for the invite :-D.
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Notable Odds - A living kind community since February 2012!
Status: closed
UPDATE: Due to complaining, I've set the comment-entries ratio as 2:1, so that people would understand that we want community active people, not the old ancient "thanks" excuses. (doesn't mean we will ignore others of course)
Greetings, community!
It's my pleasure to announce that the Notable Odds is recruiting new members for both the open and private portions of the group again. The open part of the group is open for anyone to join, assuming they meet some minimal requirements.
By being a member of the Notable Odds, you will be able to participate in many events that we organize, such as Creative contests(Writing/Drawing/Photography/Singing, with prizes), poker tournaments (with prizes), inter-group battles in TF2 and other games(and co-ops), maybe even some giveaways now and then and etc..
We are looking for people who:
1) are active;
2) nice to chat with;
3) and interested in playing games together and joining contests/events.
We are NOT looking for people to make giveaways, and you will never be expected to.
We are not interested in beggars, cheaters, or annoying people in general.
If you're interested in being a part of our community, please make a comment below indicating your interest, and whether you wish to also be considered for the private part of the group, and make sure you meet these requirements:
1) A good Steam rating
2) A good comment/entry ratio(2:1), my profile as an example
3) To keep the number of members manageable: at least $50 contribution value on steamgifts.com
4) Not someone who was just kicked from the group due to inactivity.
Those wishing to join the private portion are subject to a few further requirements. In addition to meeting the usual requirements and abiding by the usual rules:
Applicants should have a minimum gifted value of $150.
Members are expected not to leak private giveaway links (obviously).
Members are required to have at least 15 points' worth of giveaways shared only with the other members of the private part of the group every two months.
Some final information:
1) If you are interested in joining the giveaways part of the group, you will have a better chance if you participate in the group and show us that you are a nice fellow. We still re-evaluate that kind of membership at the beginning of every month.
2) The admins reserve the right to kick people out of the group without explanations. However, this only happens when people are caught disrespecting SG rules, leaking private links, or disrespecting people in general.
Notable Threads:
Groups Poker Tournament #1-Groups Poker Tournament #2-Steam Gift's Poker FFA Tournament-First Invitation-Second and Third Invitation-Forth Invitation-Fifth Invitation_First Public Invitation-Second Public Invitation-Third and Forth Invitation
Please note that these requirements are guidelines to give you an idea of how we select new members from amongst the applicants*. They are ultimately flexible and if you are interested in joining, you should feel free to say so in this thread.
*We use them as rough benchmarks for character, experience, activity, participation, and similar qualities we desire in applicants. We very frequently take mitigating circumstances into account.
TL;DR? - You won't be invited ;)
Oh and feel free to join our chat, its open for Guests, but do not beg for invites there.
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