I absolutely agree - during the past 2.5 years I just had to add more and more games to the hidden list, because they were cluttering up the site. Recently I had another time when I hid so many games, simply because I had the ones I was interested in, so the remaining ones on SG were the ones I didn't like and the ones I hadn't know yet - so I opted towards hiding the no-no games so at least I have a chance of finding new, potentially interesting games, which is kinda working.
Also about lots of (bad games) on Steam - for example Indiegala got just bloated those freshly released indies with really questionable qualities - I think IG features more new, mediocre games recently than some years' collective game palette in the past.... There are still good games, but the pile of shit around them is growing incredibly fast
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I found that steamgifts is actually a very good filter. It's pretty much the only source I use nowadays to learn about new games. I don't really care about not being the first knowing about the new hype before it starts but I'm pretty sure I learn about every hype at one point through steamgifts.
Here on steamgifts I pretty much only look at my wishlisted games. I have to many I want to play for the next couple of years anyway ;)
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More porn and digital homicede pls thanks wait what....
I agree its gone out of control so many games that are just complete trash (Don't look at my library pls).
They really need to change the way greenlight works to much nonsense gets through by ways like "Groupees" or "Gleam"
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Same thing here. I used to know every game released. Now I don't even bother. I just check the store page from time to time and the trending stuffs, and still. Now I happen to learn about the somewhat interesting games from the unfiltered SG list and add them to my WL from there, and set the WL or search filter to enter GAs.
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Best part in the video is 9:33 I laughed so hard.... but that's the sadly truth ;(
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Since it became an option I've pretty much been searching for giveaways only by Wishlist. (Though that's more to do with me feeling like I have too many games rather than there being too many games available.) A few days ago I had to kill some time so I decided to see how many games I'd have to hide from the first page of "All" giveaways so that there would be giveaways only for games I would be slightly interested in and might have entered for if my backlog wasn't monstrous. That took me hours! :/
Since then I kept occasionally clearing up the front page of... underwhelming stuff, and more of them that I hadn't seen yet just keep popping up...
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But when Humblebundle doesn't release a new bundle on Tuesday, everyone's crying. Or re-bundles. Or no 'more games coming soon'.
They did it for years.. one could be thankful for the past, but no - everyone got used to it and expects it now.
Now it seems as if they don't find as many gems as earlier anymore, though the amount of games is growing exponentially. Blame them?
I can only hope that all those new indie developers are learning by doing with more good games in the end, but for some the card fees will be enough.
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Yep, and if they can't find any, they don't make a bundle. IndieGala is the clear opposite, there are so often brand new games in their regular bundle, since everything else would mean a re-bundle for them. Still they hold on to their Monday, Wednesday, Friday bundles.
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Base numbers equal $100 times 4,200 just to get a game on Steam. while that isn't a lot in the grand scheme of things for Steam, it's not pennies either. Add in cards and sales and yeah... But don't we want Steam to stick around? If they go belly up, those of with a crapton of drm games are going to storm the castle. :-p
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what is your point? that there are good indie games out there? sure. that's not the topic here. for every good indie game there are 20 bad ones. really, really bad ones. unoriginal, unfinished, amateur-level games. and Greenlight brings them to Steam. that is the big problem.
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Not the BEST option, but every now and then I check out tags for game genres I actually like and see whats been released lately. If you know you like horror/racing/rpgs/whatever, you can cut out a good portion of junk by just checking that tag once in awhile.
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while i am a collector (and have been before the flood we are experiencing now) and love to collect games as a hobby, i agree that this has to stop. there is so much trash. and the good games suffer a lot from it (greatly reduced visibility). it's a shame. and i don't see a solution other than getting rid of Greenlight (or completely redesigning it in some way).
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For starters, Valve should make "no interested" votes on Greenlight actually count (only yes votes are accounted for at the moments) and up the threshold for minimal number of yes votes. It seems some games get GL after only a couple of hundred votes.
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yes, absolutely good points. not sure why they don't do anything after telling us they want to get rid of it so long ago. well, i can imagine why that is. they probably make good money out of it...
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Not long ago in Valve time :)
Well at least they are aware that a large number of games is a burden to many potential customers, and developing more or less successful tools to help you navigate through the store tags/queue/curators/new store front
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they should do the reverse. I understand why "no interested" don't count since people who vote "interested" should mean they want to buy it.
What I believe should happen is post launch if a game stay at negative reviews for 3 months or don't sell enough copies then they get removed.
That or 3 months after launch, the games should reappear in the front page after proving itself and having a decent amount of sales and high reviews from users.
This should be limited to indie games since AAA titles already get huge amount of visibility.
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If a game has a chance to get removed after 3 months as you say, it will create an increased demand for such a game from people who collect +1. Which means increased sales, in bundles or otherwise, which in turn means it will sell.
Of course that means increased profits for Valve so they might do just that.
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Last year about the same time I had 1200 games, now almost 4000. Including bundles I bought for trade/giveaways, I have spent around 400 euros (based on my paypal top up) which brings the price to approximately 14 cents per game. Sure I have won games here too so lets say 20 cents per game. Only bundle that I bought with my credit card is the current Yogcast one, but that goes mostly to whitelist giveaways anyway and I didnt feel like adding money to paypal at the moment.
Taking a look at how I spent card money at steam, I bought 2 games for myself (not including the 20 cent ones at sales) - Deus Ex for 80 euros and Numenera for 44 euros. The rest went to giveaways.
My point is, if you are willing to wait for a group buy - IG or daily indie gala, games are really cheap and dont impact my income very much. I do realize that I live in EU and my average wage is significantly higher than the national average, but the point still stands.
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point taken.
Then steam should drop cards only 3 months after release if the game have positive reviews.
Since I'm sure devs barely makes anything from those bundles and their revenue often relies nearly entirely on cards then it would impact them.
At the very least it would stops digital homicide type devs from existing on steam.
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That won't work unless they come up with a real way to deal with fake reviews/boost groups etc.
And no, the "steam purchases" vs "key activations" doesn't cut it, since that lumps in legit 3rd-party key sellers including physical releases with the folks that try to bribe devs with good reviews for free keys.
Neither does the "product received for free" toggle as that relies purely on the reviewer, who can lie all he/she wants.
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I've gathered a bunch of games of dubious (at best) quality, but I see what you're saying. Currently sitting at 3000+ hidden games and filtering out more each day.
What works for me is using sg++ addon and filtering out all games that are $5 or less. Since you can set it up to show group giveaways ignoring the base filter, if there is a $5 or less good game, chances are you'll see a giveaway for it in your groups and take notice of it and not just miss it completely because it's cheap.
This way you need to deal with 10s of mixed/mostly negative/ etc instead of 100s (and mostly on they days that Indie gala releases new bundles lol).
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These days, there's a general perception amongst some users that Steam is the only real form of PC gaming. There's also still some of us believe that an essential part of PC gaming is the freedom for people to release and enjoy practically anything. Of course, we don't just fit neatly into these two categories, there's many other interests and factors too, and Steam is what you get when you try to appeal to everyone. It's an awkward compromise, and pretty much all of us are losing out in some way compared to the potential ideal, but on the other hand, it's a compromise we're all accepting too, because Steam's approach is one which has kept PC gaming relevant and strong, while also being respectful of the variety of PC gaming and gamers. Compared to what you'd expect from Sony/Microsoft/Nintendo, or Ubi/EA, we're not in a bad place really.
In an ideal world, GOG, itch.io and Desura would find a way to work together and create a client which supports, but works independently of, their respective stores - that for me would be a more serious alternative or complement to Steam and potentially lead to improvements on Steam too.
(Edit: I just realised I deleted the part of this post which actually related to the OP. :D What I mean though is that I'm personally happy for now that Steam is full of everything, because if it wasn't, then I'd feel like Steam's major presence had practically killed off an important part of PC gaming.)
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I can hardly imagine sifting through over 6000 games to get to that list. After I reached about 200 on my blacklist I decided to whitelist games instead by adding them to my wishlist. Blacklisting games would be more beneficial if there were some notification when looking at a giveaway of a blacklisted game, such as when looking through a train.
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This whole mentality is perplexing. It's like walking into your local supermarket and saying to the manager. I only use Heinz tomato ketchup, why do you stock 15 other brands, 3 of which are budget brands that taste horrible.
The answer is because people have different tastes and the world doesn't revolve around yours.
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But if said ketchups are never sold in the store, only when the manufacturer of that ketchup brand dispenses lots of free or large discount coupons to the masses, then why should the supermarket keep any on the shelves, especially if keeping that quality items will make it look like a low-tier budget store that only attracts people because it is the only supermarket in the city and lots of residents already stated that they would gladly buy somewhere else where they don't have to look for the non-budget ketchup brands, if only such a store would exist in the city?
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You have a perfectly valid point and I appreciate that some games are just bad and they shouldn't be on any store, but choice is never a bad thing, Steam's embracement of all things budget has lead to the whole indie movement. Yeah, we've had to put up with people like Digial Homicide, but we have also been blessed with gems like Papers, Please, Stardew Valley and The Stanley Parable, just to name a few.
It might be inconvenient sometimes and it has brought in plenty of assholes, but I still think Steam's direction had meant a net gain for the consumer.
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Can I just add that in my opinion they're different levels of "bad" some of which are more palatable than others:
On one side of the coin you have the likes of Digital Homicide, people like that don't care about their games or gaming in general, they're just here to scam as much money out of the consumer as quickly as they can.
But on the other side you have genuine developers who have poured their blood, sweat and tears into their projects, but their game end up bad because they're just not that great at game development (yet).
I just think it's a sad day when people get shot down so brutally for following their dreams. Not only that, bad game developers still have the potential to become good game developers after they get a few shockers under their belt. By refusing to sell their games on Steam, you could potentially be condemning the next Hideo Kojima to a life of writing updates for Adobe.
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That won't be solved by a Steam greenlight. It's not like indie games are the product of the 2010s, and what Seam has with lowlife scam products is just a small tip of the iceberg that poked its head into there. Just to name one, try to look up Xing Interactive, formerly Crystal Interactive. They (or, more precisely, him) is just a good example of what really happens in budget gaming, the same thing Steam is slowly attracting.
Video games have always been like music or films, as in 90% of the created products are pure low-budget shit. Yes, there is sometimes a market for them; some people love to see German slasher horrors with a 1000-Euro budget, some people enjoyed suffering through Digital Homicide titles. But what Valve is doing is like if your local cinema that mostly showed the standard Hollywood blockbusters and maybe the award-winning independent movies, but now suddenly it shows every damn piece of cinema that usually isn't even sold in sleazy DVD stores.
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I mean, 70% of my Steam library occurred over the last two years.
So, whatever theya re deciding over there, it is working.
Shrug
EDIT: Also, I have about 6000 games hidden as well, but I don't look them all up. No way. When I scroll through the giveaway page, if I see some game I have never heard of, with a silly title, and some bad art, I block it. I only want games I want.
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the age of a steam that reviews and publish a devs game is over,
soon we will have a gazilion curators that will review and grade any number of games in the store,
and steam will do a short of metacritic/agregate of all their curators reviews.
they will also provide how strong that metacritic/agregate is based on how many have reviewed it,
I was already hinted by Lord Gaben, but they still didnt follow suit
(a similar system to the one used on greenlight, but with more "profissional" voters)
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I was watching Jim Sterling's latest video yesterday and it made me realize why I've been spending less and less time on SteamGifts.
Video
This chart made by Steam Spy shows that 4200 games were added to Steam in 2016. That's 40% of Steam's entire library. And 3000 games last year. Compare this to 2012-2013, when I reached my peak of SG activity. 380 games 565 games. The second half of 2014 started the decline for me. I think part of it was the deluge of shitty games and countless bundles that started happening.
When SGv2 launched, I had over 1000 games "Hidden", and I though that was a lot. Now I have almost 6000. That's 5000 shitty games I've had to look at review scores for, check out their Steam page, maybe watch a trailer. Just to find out it's another shitty shovelware title on Steam. It's not worth my time anymore. My biggest frustration now is trying to find out which games actually ARE worth it in this sea of garbage. I love great indie games, all of my favorite games from the last few years have been indies. But I'm not sure how to find out about them anymore.
I dunno, I'm not sure what the point of this post is. Maybe just to share my shock about the rate at which Steam's storefront is growing, and not in a good way.
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