With which party do you side?
You have a mindset of a true freeloader
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0y-lYSJGaI4
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That's what we call bias. "I don't care who is right, but I like them, because they give me free games, so I want them to win".
EDIT: Also, if I this is the case I've seen so long time ago that Epic just broke the conditions of their agreement, it means that Epic broke the law. So basically, they are just using cool looking words, that are full of lies. But that doesn't even surprise me, because Epic did that since the very beginning. Lies on lies. They are making monopoly, saying they are ones fighting with it. And I doubt they have changed. They are hypocrites. Breaking law, saying that they are messiah for gamers. BS.
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Maybe I'll be sad for Epic when they stop bothering me with their horrible 2FA.
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I mean, I dislike Epic's business practices a lot. But in this case, Apple and his wallet garden - on your knees, do what you are told or you are out - is much worse.
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Google is pretty much the same. Only they leave the door slightly open to protect themselves against this kind of lawsuit: "Eh, you know, you are free to install apps from outside the official store" - Yeah sure, if you want to spend your life clicking on confirmation screens with every single update... 🤔🤔
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Google is almost the same, true. But at least they allow a little bit to install other things. And I have the amazon app store and a few apps from outside google without much trouble.
Apple in at least regard, is much worse.
Man, I actually hate to be defending Epic
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And yet, Epic choose to intentionally break their contract to get an excuse to move masses because "YOU DESERVE BETTER!!! ᵃⁿᵈ ʷᵉ ʷᵃⁿᵗ ᵐᵒʳᵉ ᵐᵒⁿᵉʸ". Epic knew they had to do something big, to not get blamed for simply hostage the game off Apple devices and not be seen as greed/bad guys if they simply told Apple their store's contract was terrible.
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What exactly is clickbait about the title?
The process is expected to deliver many interesting documents and facts about both companies and their stores.
Should I have added "from a games industry perspective" to satisfy you?
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Very interesting info, I miss GTA V stats, that freebie was crazy.
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Thanks for posting and please keep it updated, when new docs show up.
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Whatever happens here will probably decide how Wolfire Games (Humble Bundle creator) v. Valve goes, so keep that in mind
I'm not too interested in Epic getting any ground unless they start opening up their submissions for EGS
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Apple are definitely worse than Epic in a lot of ways. They are indeed attempting to become a monopoly. They sue anyone that they think they can bully, (like going after Aussie Woolworths over a logo that would never in a million years be mistaken for the apple logo, and making a deal that they can never sell music, also like that Apple records lawsuit over a record label that was around before they even existed, and so many similar messed up cases) yet they enter more and more markets themselves. Absolute pricks.
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Apple made the conscientious decision not to become a monopoly (they could have licensed IOS to other phone manufacturers)
Apple's view is that they provide a superior product, and that people pay a premium for that. As part of that premium product, they provide strict standards on the App store.
The lawsuit with Woolworths makes a lot more sense if you understand trademark law.
As for Apple Records (owned by the Beatles), that's a lot more complicated, but it goes back to the late seventies, when Apple Records sued Apple Computer Company.
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I understand trademark law and I understand what they were doing. That does not mean that I agree with apple's position. They took an inanimate object, an apple, and decided that any representation of an apple, no matter if it's abstract, entitles them to bring people to court. I studied Media Law as part of my Master's and guess who I used as my case study on trademark law. XD Apple records and Woolworths were only two examples. They've done this to many more.
I design logos and brand identities for a living. I think I understand it well enough. Imagine if every company did what apple do, or try to do. We wouldn't have anything left to use in new designs. LOL.
So you see, I do own Apple computers, (only because I've been using them since I started uni in 2003, they were necessary then, and am a creature of habit) but I have made the conscientious decision not to buy into the premium product BS and own Android everything else.
It was once true that Apple were a premium product. But, not they use the perception of a premium product to charge premium prices for not so premium parts. They get more expensive and the components get cheaper. People will start to wise up and catch on, but I think they rely on selling to the hipster crowd who buy new products every year or two anyways to always have the latest thing.
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That is an interesting document. I reeeeally want to see the same figures for everything else to date. There have been many more big names since then (GTAV, CIv VI, Borderlands Collection, Watch Dogs 1&2, Alien: Isolation) and a lot of indies to compare them to. If Epic has managed to sustain a $2.37 customer acquisition cost, they're actually in really good shape.
Big shout out to all the Fortniters who are funding this project with their dad's credit cards!
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None of them are saints but to hell with Ep!c because if they win, say good by to the open platform that is PC. Everything will be EP!C exclusive. You buy from us or don't buy at all, on an open platform (with ZERO features or support)!
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Oh wow, now this is big tinfoil hat power lol, coupled with the self-censoring because of such intense hate, and thinking that it means anything :D
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Wow, what a useful comment!
EP!C is quite epic so yeah, I like to spell like that.
Tinfoil? Dude, just open your eyes, do the basic research on how EGS operates from the get go, who the "actual" owners are and you'll see what their endgame is.
If you want to buy from them, well, do it! Your money, your choice!
But millions of games like myself also have made a decision to not give a crap about EP!C.
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You know you're just digging the hole deeper, don't you?
The apple vs epic lawsuit is about circumventing Epic with microtransactions on apple machines. How that changes on the fact that vast majority of the games are PC are not epic exclusive, and the minority that was, is timed only?
I don't really plan on buying from them, to see you're in the same category as people who are going around and spit-yelling about Bill G@tes, womyn, m*n and the conspiracy theories/ideologies from their enlightened lair.
I'm happy for you to be one of the millions of games. I hope your publisher will treat you fairly. Have a nice day.
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I'm happy for you to be one of the millions of games. I hope your publisher will treat you fairly. Have a nice day.
:-D laughing
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Dude, I loved the movie Holes (2003), so I like to dig deeper. (You should see it; if not, I can fix that ;)
"I hope your publisher will treat you fairly. Have a nice day."
Anyway, I'm not affiliated with any publisher/dev so don't know where that came from (or my English is not that good). Even if I become Dev, I'll make sure not sing shoddy deals.
"The apple vs epic lawsuit is about circumventing Epic with microtransactions on apple machines"
Yes, and people think doing that is OK. Epic is using and misleading those Fortnite kids to do their bidding which is wrong, so I have less sympathy from them (compared to Apple, who are still douchebags mind you)
"How that changes on the fact that vast majority of the games are PC are not epic exclusive, and the minority that was, is timed only?"
Bait and Switch? Announcing on one platform and snatching away at the last moment? Not improving their store front?
"to see you're in the same category as people who are going around and spit-yelling about Bill G@tes, womyn, m*n and the conspiracy theories/ideologies from their enlightened lair."
I don't know what is going on in your mind but don't care about Billy boy or stupid gender fights or even the so called civil fights. They are all being manipulated. Hope you are OK because you seemed quite angry, for a mere discussion! I would have preferred a good sarcastic reply.
Chaos is a ladder!
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As long as games keep coming to Steam I don't care much about their timed exclusivity. I was suprised about amount of money they paid to some indies though, it is much lower than I had expected.
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That's true but still, they took the exclusivity and will "pay" the price, so to say.
I usually don't buy these games unless heavily discounted (75% +) or in a bundle. Thankfully, not many games I would have liked have gone this route and the ones I like, played them on Game pass for peanuts!
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The only way I could be less interested in the outcome of this lawsuit would be for it to be football related.
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I still laugh at all this:
Epic: "we are good guys, we want you all to save 20% by giving us money DIRECTLY! ᵃⁿᵈ ᶦᶠ ᵃᵖᵖˡᵉ ˡᵒʷᵉʳˢ ᵗʰᵉᶦʳ ᶠᵉᵉ ʷᵉ ʷᶦˡˡ ʳᵉᵐᵒᵛᵉ ᵗʰᶦˢ ᵖᵃʸᵐᵉⁿᵗ ᵐᵉᵗʰᵒᵈ" Also we have a cool video to show you soon!"
Apple: "thats illegal, you broke your contract to NOT give us a portion of EVERY AND ALL transacctions"
Epic: "SURPRISE, the video is to show you why Apple is bad and why YOU should move social media because we intentionally broke our contract and got the game removed!"
Epic keep claiming to be the good guys...but keep enforcing so much like they are the only ones who opinion and acction should matter....and apple is no different either.
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That doesn't mean much if only 7% of users who claimed a free game bought something from the store, and they had great sales with coupons.
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One should keep in mind that Epic very likely made some package deals which aren't covered in the list.
Metro for $0 would be the most obvious example, which probably was covered by the Metro Exodus EGS exclusivity deal.
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If Epic wins and you can use other softwares which not intendeed to use for free when you publish something with it and you want to make money when publishing something with it / on it, that will mean that everyone can publish games with Unreal Engine and noone need to pay anything to Epic right? Because i dont see difference between the cases.
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That's nonsense.
A platform has nothing to do with a software type.
They actually block your hardware to use certain software because they can so.
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I just hope one day we'll have a united storefront where I'll be able to buy games from a shop and DLC from another. The whole "you own game X on store Y, so you must buy addons for that game only on store Y" is not free market.
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That does/did exist:
You can buy a game on steam and DLC from humble bundle.
If that's not good enough, I bought Mass Effect 2 on Steam, and the DLC from the only place it was available - Origin.
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I don't understand why they sell keys for Steam and not for GOG or EGS and other stores. Just let me get the key for the store I use.
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even the SS is EPIC!!!
good job epic, so epic i get eye cancer
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I could see the future somehow.
"EpicApple" and the company name change.
Steven Paul Jobs died.
The apple was rotten there.🍎
The eyelid has become a legend.
so sad.
Anyway, both companies are suspicious from me.
The story changes, but the condition of the space translator recently remains significantly bad.
Is it human hacking or spam?
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For the ongoing lawsuit (Epic vs. Apple) in Europe there was a very positive statement from the European Commission in the last few days - also from an Antitrust lawsuit against Apple.
Yeah, this lawsuit is about a music streaming service, but the (from the European Commission) critized rules are the same rules as with Epic. So most likely they will support Epic as well.
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I'm surprised Epic didn't sue Apple in Europe - the EU is a lot more open to those types of complaints.
Makes me think the whole thing was just a PR move, and they don't expect to win
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Epic sued Apple in Europe as well. As far as I know, there are lawsuits in the US, Europe, Australia and the UK.
Here's the announcement for the lawsuit in Europe: https://www.epicgames.com/site/en-US/news/epic-games-files-eu-antitrust-complaint-against-apple
But compared to the lawsuit in the US it can be expected that the lawsuit in Europe will run for a few years. European authorities are really slow in such cases, so I don't think we can expect a verdict before 2023 (personally I would say 2025). For example the case of Spotify was from 2019 - now we have 2021 and there's no end in sight.
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Lol its all about business dude, Epic is not a saint either. Its seem like a lot people forgot about all the shady-exclusive on their store, where is the justice in that ? They literally use money to buy users, and looks like a lot people took the bait already...
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Both are terrible companies but in this case I side with Epic.
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What can or can't be on our devices should be only dictated by their hardware capabilities and not by some private boardroom meeting.
It's not only Epic vs Apple but about all the big players like Google or Valve with their "stores". By their market dominance they are able to dictate what will be visible and kicking everybody not playing by their book thus exerting a silent censorship without any public control.
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If this is true for all of them then yes, sure. But why no one (Epic in particular) is mad at Sony or Nintendo for 30% cut? Why no one demands their own store on these platforms? Tim Swiney even defends these two companies.
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That's a good question I've no answer for. Public outrage is always a bit irrational and inconsistent.
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Thats what i hate about Epic, they always try to be this goofy-two-shoes guy, but in reality they are just two faced company
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Picking your battles one by one, I guess. Fortnite being PC only if they get kicked out of every console and mobile would be too much of a blow. I expect Epic will go after Sony/Nintendo if they win against Apple/Google
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Highly doubt it. Nintendo - maybe, but I still don't believe it, and Sony isn't going to happen for sure as almost half of overall Fortnite revenue comes from PS4. Not to mention Sony investing $1 billion in EGS.
By the way, regarding revenues (2018-2020): 46,8% PS4, 27,5% XONE, 7% IOS, 18,7% PC+Switch+Android.
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It's not only Epic vs Apple but about all the big players like Google or Valve with their "stores".
No, because you can't install an alternative store on an iPhone/iPad, you must use the Apple Store to download any app.
Meanwhile, you can use any store on PC and you can install any app on Android or even an alternative store. The Play Store is preinstalled but it is not mandatory. I use an iPhone but I'm on Epic's side in this lawsuit.
Because the Apple Store is obligatory, Apple may charge whatever they want for the micro transactions and purchases. There's no competition so they will try to play the antitrust card.
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Nice that You explained what's the lawsuit is about, so we know what's going on.
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Quite interesting that the second person is complaining like that. This is one of the biggest current news events, it's in any TV news and newspaper. If you are even slightly interested in news, you know what's happening.
And there still is Google or wiki for people refusing to consume news regularly. Do you think I might do a better job than any of them, summarizing such a gigantic process or do you just lack self-initiative?
But sure, why not instead post some snarky comment in a thread that was supposed to focus on information that is NOT part of the TV news and the headlines in newspapers, but of special interest for people here?
But as you said: "Nice".
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I've heard of it like half a year ago or even earlier. But I don't remember any Internet dramas/scandals. Also I don't watch news or read newspapers. I don't need other people to think for me. Also, if someone just say something, they should always explain what's it about. Like a source, explanation etc. And people do that even when the case is known, so people can read what's it about if they don't know yet.
Also You really think I will be reading tons of text to just understand random post on the random site on the Internet? I've found Wiki article, but I'm not going to rad whole book on one single puny case. I just assumed it's probably the same case when Epic broke law, breaking the agreements with Apple. If that's not it, I'm not going to check it out. I don't have time to read half of the Internet. Also if that IS the case I mentioned, that I explained it in one sentence.
Snarky comment? It's Your job to explain what You are talking about. Sorry, if You are new to the world. But if You want to discuss something, You are obligated to give information on what You are talking about. And if I'm second person, that means there is a need. probably there is even more, but they don't just bother reading things, You don't want to explain. This is clickbait without explanation. And if that's the same case I explained already, then it's easy to give one or two sentences, saying what's it about. And at least some sources on what's going on, who does what. Otherwise I can't even comment on the case, because I don't know what is it about.
But sure, be mad that people make "snarky comments". If that's Your shield, because You don't want to give explanation...
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"Also You really think I will be reading tons of text to just understand random post on the random site on the Internet?"
I can't decide if burying that line in the middle of four paragraphs is brilliant satire or severe d'oh.
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My comment is like 1% of what I would need to read if I read the Wiki article. Also it's a middle of discussion. Discussion consist of words. Or am I wrong? Your comment is just trying to be sharp, but You failed.
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We get it. You want to be spoon-fed the information instead of looking for yourself. You don't check the news, you don't have the time to read the whole Internet... well, maybe OP didn't have time to craft a proper summary. And no, it wasn't an obligation to do so.
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I immediately saw "It's your job" and ignored the rest. 😉
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Based on what I've read from that particular user, it's just severe d'oh. They're definitely one of the SG members who make me facepalm the most.
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ouch. no one is obligated anything to anyone. random person on the internet has no obligations to you how to write their post, and even your own family have no obligations to you how to live their own lives.
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In the Epic vs Apple lawsuit, some interesting documents are expected to appear. The first one covers the first 9 months of Epic's free games, how much each game did cost them, how many users it acquired etc.
Source
Sadly there isn't a better image available yet.
Edit 1:
Documents from Epic's and Apple's openings are online as PDFs. They seem to be up and down frequently. And incomplete?
Link
Edit 2:
There are also more details available for the deal between Epic and 2k.
Edit 3:
There is new information about the EGS, covering sales in 2019 and 2020. Source
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