It's a compromise I have to make. If I just posted a "reveal" buried in someone's thread it might not be seen by enough users to provide meaningful data, let alone get a similar amount of views as other reveals. Having it all in one thread helps me equalize things and control visibility. I can of course dedicate a thread for each reveal, but this would probably be too annoying
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Except posting this thread beforehand will skew your results.
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Why didn't you just conduct the experiment and then post the results later? Seems weird to sabotage your results preemptively.
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Actually, I may have misunderstood your proposal. Do you mean keep things as they are (i.e. be open what this experiment is about), but only post the results at the end? This might be a good idea...
Edit: Another option is to just post the change each day, but not the direction. For example "WL ±2, BL ±4". Then, after the experiment ends, update the numbers with the direction (plus/minus).
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I was saying that you should have simply posted your views without stating intent. For better or worse, revealing the purpose of your experiment beforehand manipulates the results. Which is cool if that's what you wanted to do, it just wasn't the impression I gathered from your OP.
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I was stating a fact and joking at the same time :-)
And yes, this experiment has far less potential now that cg implemented mutual blacklists. Still, I'm sure I'll get quite a few blacklists in the next few days. I get them regularly even without posting a lot of controversial stuff.
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Yirg reveals that he doesn't like chocolate
Hang the infidel! He has brought great dishonor to his steamgifts family. Bring the pitchforks, the tar, and the feathers!
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Too late. I already posted my very-controversial chocolate opinion last year.
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Me being me basically ( that means not bullshitting around and telling things which needs to be told ) landed me in many many BL. That's the cost of having opinion i guess :)
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HaHa I almost spat my coffee over my monitor lol
I love Trumpton, it was one of my favorite shows when I was kid.
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I still love to watch one now and again - such happy memories :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqZvuUbL-eU&list=PLAFCDEA23E7B520F9
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It's been a few years since I've seen them but I'll watch em again soon, cheers :D
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skew
skjuː/
verb
past tense: skewed; past participle: skewed
1.
suddenly change direction or position.
"the car had skewed across the track"
twist or turn or cause to do this.
"he skewed around in his saddle"
2.
make biased or distorted in a way that is regarded as inaccurate, unfair, or misleading.
"the curriculum is skewed towards the practical subjects"
Not sure when it happened - but it clearly did become the norm :)
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ah - there is the kicker - "as far as im aware" [SIC]
you are not able to know all, so your knowledge may be incomplete, so in the future you may become aware - or not :)
Also, if enough people throughout time have altered the norm, then the norm has become that which it has been altered to - nothing is preserved in aspic after all :)
Yirg is looking at the skewed responses - which end with a BL or a WL - that is the skewed nature of somebodies response in this instance - the statistical tail comes afterwards - at which point the asymmetry of the probability distribution can be measured - before that it is skewed by the interpretation of peoples minds
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You're just arguing between prescriptivism (your view) and descriptivism (Loupou's view). But honestly, in a colloquial setting where (most) everyone understands what Yirg means by "skewed", what's the issue? It's like calling someone out for using "ain't". It's not really a real word but enough people used it that everyone knows what the speaker means when they use it. Hell, it's even in the dictionary now.
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Shrug. It's a matter of context. For example, most people, when they hear "positive reinforcement" they think "reinforcement through good things". But in the field of psychology it actually means "reinforcement by addition of something" regardless of any notion of good or bad. Does that mean the phrase "positive reinforcement" can't ever be used to mean "reinforcement through good things" even though it could very well be "through bad things"? I personally don't think so. I mean, if we want to bring accuracy in fields into the discussion then there's the class of linguists that I mentioned earlier, descriptivist linguists, who say if enough people use it a certain way, it's right in their culture. Language is so subjective sometimes it's baffling.
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Who is going to bl you if you post GAs for stuff they may want?
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Ooh I didn't think about this aspect. Not sure what to do now. Maybe delete and recreate these GAs scheduled to next week?
Edit: I'll leave it as is. These are the current rules of the game. People know that when they blacklist a user, they might be missing out on some good GAs by him or her.
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The more shrewd person will bl you after the GAs have ended :D
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Blacklisting doesn't remove you from current giveaways, afaik, it just prevents your from entering in the future.
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Yes, if you entered them before.
Also, if he posts more GAs and revelations it's better to wait for the event to end and then bl him ;)
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I don't care about people's opinions enough to blacklist anyone for them, everyone's is different so it's best to just accept it.
What happens in the real world when these people who don't agree with someone's opinion and there's no blacklist button to push.
You've been on my whitelist for awhile and can't see me changing it just because of what you mght think.
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in real world you can ignore people with other opinions too ^^ ... don't meet them.... don't hear there talking.... and so on...
without a button :-D
If this is necessary and/or ok is a other thing ;)
It give a lot of people in Reallife that can not handle people with other opinions
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If people can ignore others in real life then surely they can ignore a few words on a monitor screen, don't need no button either way. :)
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I can only speak from myself now....
In RL i can ignore people, what i normaly not make.
When i not like anyone i say him that and each one see/feel/know exactly what i think and how i will react when he/she do this or that. Because my life is to short to waste my time with such people i try to avoid any contact with them :D grinning
I say what i think and mean what i say ... that's the shortest explanation to it.
On sg i use the WL and BL much.
Because here are much much much more people than around me in Reallife :o) (and i not give in RL Games to people i don't like... so why should i do it in sg ?)
Easy ways to come on my BL (examples):
That i not become stuff from this people after Blacklisting them is more then ok for me.
To come on my WL (examples):
By the WL it is harder to explain because there is not so much dedicated. I act there more on the feelings. At the BL mostly more on the logical thinking (Problem ----> Solution ----> Problem solved).
I hope i explained it good enough....
(at the moment i am very sleepy... not sleeped this night... not the best for a "old" guy^^)
I have a bit more whitelisted then blacklisted (i must maximum/push my HATE to change this :DDDD).
And i am on around 4x so many WL then BL (that looks very clear :o) -and yes i am a bit proud on it- (hey i am a male ... size matters... and when it is only by the WL :DDDD laughing)
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I understand all the reasons of why people BL and WL, we all have our own reasons most of which are probably about the same but too me blacklisting someone just because their opinion is different to mine just seems like being back on the sk00l playground.
If we did this in our everyday life then we'd all be on our own staring at the wall wondering why we have no friends. Having different opinions is how we communicate ideas and sort problems out etc. We wouldn't be here today with the knowledge and technology we have if we didn't have different opinions.
I have quite a few on my BL but none are because I didn't agree with someones opinion but that's what makes us all unique, differences.
No worries about being tired I totally understand as I have trouble sleeping most nights and I'm an "older" guy. :P
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A lot of people BL because people not have the same opinion as they.
Most of my BL, that i got, is from that.
Because i say my opinion, thinking and such stuff.
A lot of people see that as "attack" or have learned that we can ACCEPT a other opinion and not must have the same, without any problem :).
And a lot of people are not capable to discuss (they say there opinion and when you not share it then is all shi* = thats not a discussion)
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Strange things these lists ya guys have here I must say. I found it kind of amusing to be honest. I haven't really entered giveaways in the last almost 4 years now (nor created one, I'm not active anymore), and I haven't posted anything in the past 2-ish years. Didn't hold someone back from blacklisting me last January though, so that gave me a good chuckle.
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I noticed that I got 5 BL instantly after posting in one contreversial thread. :D Not that I care - but this just points out the hypocracy. Everyones screaming about free speech but starts to attack anyone who actually voices their opinion.
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May I ask if that was before or after cg implemented Two-Way Blacklists? This change made the dynamics of blacklisting quite a bit different from what it was in the past.
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Could have been after. Looks like that update was posted 4 months ago.. so most likely after that..
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You did not tell us what kind of statistical analysis you will use - math-listed!
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As is clear by quite a few comments, my methodology in this experiment is, to put it mildly, questionable. Expect no statistical analysis, just numbers that might give some sense about how voicing controversial opinions in this forum affects one's whitelist and blacklist numbers.
The first results are in, see the spoiler-tagged text in the OP, but I suggest to lower expectations (if you had any) ;-)
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GL yirg. Hope you don't get too many negative outcomes but it will be interesting to see how your experiment goes. :)
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Well, giving games away while giving your opinions won't make you be so judged for your opinions as you would be if you just said them. Just saying.
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That's true, but I created 201 threads on this forum, and I can't recall the last time I created a thread without giveaways. Force of habit I guess. Deleting those giveaways now would probably have it's own effect on the results, and probably not the same effect as creating the thread without giveaways to begin with.
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hmmm - creating a thread without a giveaway could be one of your things :P I have seen a number of people complaining when one gets made (but never seen any rule in the FAQ where it says one is required) - odd
oh and sorry for bombing your thread with replies - I am updating our shop search strings and adverts - and it is soooo boring :(
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already have you whitelisted :P
anyway i dont WL or BL based on opinions everyone is free to have there own, as long as they accept other peoples believe, WL or BL are given for ratio, being friendly/hating ect :)
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How dare you to spread your opinion which doesnt match with mine? As long as people are civil they shouldnt be whitelisted or blacklisted for opinions. But people seek to find something they can waste their time on in this boring world where they can sit around and dont have to work 24/7 like in the old times including me too, of course :D
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Ever wondered how being vocal about yourself or your opinions affects your whitelist and blacklist count? I know I did, and although I voiced my opinions in some controversial threads (e.g. the ones about US elections), I never set out check this properly. Until today.
In each of the next 5 days I'll post a revealing thing about myself. In the following day I will let you know how many WL and BL I lost/gained, but to minimize bias I won't say in which direction until the experiment ends. To prevent having GAs skew the results, yet to still keep things in good giving order, I'll only post the GAs now, a day before I start posting the "reveals". The numbers in each list before the first reveal will be the baseline, but I'll keep them to myself and only report the increase/decrease. Suffice to say, I have three digit numbers in each list so plenty of room for reduction :-)
Oct 1
GA posting day (all Level 0, no filters) [All Finished]
Pony IslandThe Stanley ParableKilling Floor 2Oct 2
I am Israeli and Jewish. I also served in the military, as a photographer. I'll dedicate a couple of reveals in coming days to my social and political views and to those I have on religion, but will add a few words here about my views of Israel military. I think a strong army is an unfortunate necessity for my country, and that there are few areas where Israeli military activities could have been significantly different yet still achieve the goal of defending the country. A few points where I object to how things are/were done: Use of administrative detention; use of one-ton bomb or similar for some not-so-targeted targeted killings; reprisal operations during the 50's and 60's. A few points where I think the army has much to pride itself on: Purity of arms ethical code, and specifically the extreme efforts that go into avoiding civilian causalities, with Roof-knocking procedure being a prime example. Another example is the huge investment Israel makes in developing defensive anti-missile missiles of different ranges - Iron Dome, David's Sling, Arrow - all of which, by definition, reduce civilian causalities (on both sides) compared to the alternatives.
Update: Gained 9 WL, Gained 1 BL.
Oct 3
I am agnostic-atheist. I've yet to encounter anything that would make me believe in God, so I don't. I believe it's impossible to prove that God exists, so I don't frequently spend time thinking or talking about this subject. I'm also not troubled by questions like "Where did the matter and energy in the universe come from?" ...I don't know the answer, and I doubt I'll ever hear a convincing explanation. As far as I'm concerned, God isn't a convincing explanation to such questions. I can at least find answers to some related questions in the theory of evolution, which I find very convincing.
In addition, I'm secular. I do celebrate most Jewish holidays every year, but I don't do it because of what they mean to religious people. I do it because I enjoy many of the traditions, I enjoy being with my extended family, and the holidays give a great framework for this. Similarly when I'm invited by people of other religions or cultures to celebrate their holidays, I seize the opportunity and gladly participate.
Update: Gained 5 WL, Gained 1 BL.
Oct 4
My political ideology is mostly left wing and social-liberal. I believe the state should ensure that the basic needs of everyone are met, yet still reward people for hard work, enterprise and innovation. With the increase of automation (autonomous trucks anyone?), I believe more and more people won't be able to find a job. The only way I see to go about it would be for the state to ensure basic income to all. As a (currently) working person, I accept this and am willing to pay for it. I already pay about 40% taxes, and although I don't agree with everything my country does with the money, I do think that the amount of taxation is roughly where it needs to be if the country aims to fund (or at least subsidize) important things like universal healthcare, college education and paid parental leave. This is why I don't advocate for reduction of taxes, but do want to see the budget used better.
I always voted for left wing parties. This unfortunately means that my votes have been somewhat wasted most of the years, given the political system in Israel (where opposition/minority parties can work on legislation, but have very limited impact otherwise). I think the current prime minister of Israel (Netanyahu) and the party he belongs to are both bad for the country and that their supporters are blind not to see it. I think Donald Trump is wildly incompetent and is on track to become one of the worst presidents in US history, and that Hillary Clinton would have been perfect for the job.
A few quick points - I believe the state and religion should be separated; abortion should be legal; guns should in most cases only be accessible to the armed forces, not regular citizens; I'm against the death penalty; I'm for immigration, based mostly on merit, not religion or nationality (though I understand and agree to why it had to be different when Israel was founded, a few years after the holocaust). I'm strongly in favor of equal rights and responsibilities to all, but accept that there are some areas where it's not easy to implement (e.g. drafting and arming a citizen who openly opposes the existence of the state is not a good idea). Climate change is real and largely caused by humans.
Update: Gained 5 WL, No change to BL.
Oct 5
As requested (by one user), below are some opinions I have about SteamGifts. Most are not that revelatory, and only one or two are likely to be really controversial.
Update: Gained 7 WL, No change to BL (though there was some fluctuation during the day).
Oct 6
I'm a feminist. There’s great inequality to this day between men and women, with men being very frequently oppressive of women. It boggles the mind that so many women say they are “not a feminist”, while experiencing inequality, oppression and the negative sides of male dominance of society. Feminism really needs better marketing, because most arguments of those non-feminist women are quite detached from what feminism actually is (hint: it’s not about hating men).
A few notes about myself. I had women bosses and had zero issue with it. One of them was probably the best boss I had. I find working with women just as easy, if not more, than working with men. People who claim women bring “drama” to the workplace don’t know what they’re talking about, because it’s completely detached from reality. If anything, they're probably projecting their own views on reality.
In general, there's hardly anything that's important to modern living where men have an inherent born advantage over women, or the other way around. The vast majority of non-physical differences are due to how boys and girls are raised. I'm raising my 3-year old daughter to have as much knowledge and as many skills as possible, including skills traditionally associated with boys and men. There's no chance in hell that, when she's older, she won't know how to replace a wheel of a car or drill a hole in the wall. Hopefully I’m not alone in this.
Update: Gained 10 WL, No change to BL.
Summary: Gained 36 WL and 2 BL. I'm pretty sure that I would have been added to more blacklists before the advent of Two-Way Blacklists, or if I didn't include giveaways at the top of this post. The way to tell for sure would be to create a similar thread without giveaways, but it's too late for this now. Maybe in a few months, but I'm running out of opinions that I think are potentially blacklist-worthy. Also, my pretty good ratio may have something to do with the results. If my numbers of wins and created giveaways were reversed, I probably would have been added to more blacklists, and less whitelists. All in all though it seems less "risky" to voice one's opinions than many people think. I hope this experiment encourages more people to not hold back and be more open, and I also hope it doesn't backfire if they do ;-)
Note: I'm not going to participate in an endless debate about each reveal. The information in each should be sufficient for people to decide if they see enough to put me on one of their lists, or if (and I hope that's the typical case) they just see these as opinions that one should be able to make, even if they disagree.
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