I think I'm doing it wrong >_>
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First rule of SG: Don't talk about blacklisting.
Rule #2: Blacklist anyone who doesn't follow rule #1
Just kidding but happens for real though. My blacklist has reached the massive level of zero.
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Well, 0 is halfway to infinite - it's not a laughing matter xD
Don't you misquote Fight Club! I do plan on seeing it again soon though, a great movie.
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I'm pretty sure some users blacklist others just because they can.
As to how they think they can justify it, it can be literally anything.
Controversial opinions? Freedom of speech is a thing only as long as THEY benefit from it. Blacklisted.
Anything can be a "controversial opinion", even with something as simple as "the sky is blue" or "fire is hot", somebody is bound to disagree with it.
Heck, there're still people who believe the Earth is flat and the Sun circles it, and that vaccines cause autism.
Low amount of giveaways? Low ratio? Too many wins? A mix of one or more of these?
Blacklisted. "Generous gifters" don't like filthy leechers. Even though they're the ones who gave them that sweet sweet CV that let their level rise.
Too many freebies? Too much shovelware? Not enough AAAs? Blacklisted.
Some users don't like bundle trash. Unless they're the ones farming it en masse to inflate their e-peens (CV and number of gifts sent ).
You won a AAA giveaway?
Blacklisted. Someone wanted to add it to their dusty collection, and never touch it again, 'cause all they ever play is CSGO/DOTA2/TF2/PUBG/whatever).
You didn't send a key 3 seconds after space cat appeared?
Blacklisted, 'cause they NEED their stuff, and quick (gotta farm fast, before market values drop and they lose profitz).
If it's not that, they might dislike your nickname, your avatar, your country, your friends, your groups, your pets, the games you play, what you ate for breakfast...
Whatever you do, say, or think (heck, you don't even need to do, say, or think anything) there'll always be someone who thinks they're "holier than thou".
TL;DR: if you're registered on Steam Gifts, you WILL be blacklisted. Sooner or later. It's somewhat of a rite of passage.
At least blacklists are bidirectional now, so if someone blacklists you, they're prevented from entering your giveaways.
And the moment that changed, it's when we really got to see who the real hypocrites were...
And then, there're the legit (and semi-legit) reasons, like rule breakers, spammers, leakers, ungrateful winners, autojoiners, and so on.
Another practice that's more widespread than it should, is blacklisting winners, so that other users have more chances in the next giveaways.
My criteria for blacklistling users, was that it was a list of users who I wouldn't want to gift games to, and this obviously included a lot of rule breakers, at least until I realized that the limit of one thousand entries would never be enough, and level restrictions make for a much better blacklist when most are low level.
Group and invite giveaways also help cutting off a good amount, since most don't even bother stepping outside of public giveaways.
For everyone else, there's still the blacklist, though it's almost empty, because, at this point, I honestly don't care enough anymore.
I just report users when needed, and let support do their magic.
So much hard work for free, and they constantly get bashed, they're really the heroes we need but don't deserve.
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Thank you for your input! I like your writing style and appreciate the time you took.
But yes, it seems inevitable to get blacklisted. Just by opening this thread I doubled/tripled the number of blacklists I am on. But as someone else here said it , along the lines of "look at it as a blessing in disguise", and I think I wholeheartedly agree with that.
And in the end I do think that setting up your giveaways with level/group/whitelist limitations is somewhat more effective of a means, and requires less effort.
Praise the support indeed if they do their job for free - it's an ungrateful but necessary thing, big respect.
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Just to give you an example about how this blacklist stuff works: I'm a user who's never broken any rule, I've never been suspended, I never express potentially controversial opinions, I never argue with other users, and when I do participate in discussions, I always try to be polite, or, at the very least, neutral/informative.
I try to keep my (real CV) ratio positive at all times, and all my stats balanced (I don't "leech from the public while only giving to groups and the forum"), I only enter giveaways for games that I actually plan to (eventually) play, and make sure to thank when I win.
In short, I'm not blacklist material, at least if we go by the most common definitions.
And yet, I'm on 68 blacklists (at the time of this comment). They used to be 75 or so before the mutual blacklist update.
To this day, I've only been able to identify less than half of them.
I guess anime avatars might have something to do with this. The most evident application of the "dislike your avatar" part.
And in the end, nothing of value was lost. They actually did me a favour.
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Well yeah, when a lot of people from different backgrounds gather there's bound to be some friction and disagreement - but as you said - they did you a favor. I even dared to post a controversial opinion but my hubris did not end there, I even made this thread! So... coughs blood...tell my wife... tell her I died a hero."
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Let me check my blacklist... Wait, impossible, it's empty! ☮
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How dare you be a nice person?! Preposterous!!
But nah, thank you for your input!
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I never put anyone to blacklist, but i got 3 unknowns user's blacklist and i don't know why, is my low vocabulary the cause ? (i have a medium knowledge from english language)
or is just a a person who's got blacklisted everyone? hahaha
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Thank you for the input!
Could be anything indeed. Or perhaps it's because you won so much and gave so little, who can say - 3 isn't too bad however, don't let it get to you!
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Maybe is this the cause, i give only one key in this community, i will find some here to give.
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It might be the reason but at the same time I might be wrong. If you can give, do it, it's a good thing! If currently you can't waiting until you are comfortable doing so is better in my opinion!
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Long comment incoming! Scroll past while you still can.
What makes an "open mind" and whether an open mind is even a good or moral thing is a fun topic of discussion. I think it's worth reading up on Karl Popper's paradox of tolerance. The TL;DR is that if people are promoting an intolerant society (e.g. a society where races are segregated), it doesn't make sense to try to "tolerate" their viewpoint because it'll just lead to them destroying any semblance of tolerance when they gain political power. So to protect a broadly just and safe society, sometimes you have to put your foot down.
This is important for e.g. refusing to harbor people who promote harmful conspiracy theories or violence against [insert segment of humanity.] It's more of a grey area when it's just someone saying intolerant things, because that can be allowed within reason. But I generally agree with where Popper draws the line, i.e. at the people who aren't even willing to rationally argue for their intolerant viewpoint and anyone who tries to escalate intolerance to the point of violence.
Anyways, the general morality of open-mindedness and my blacklisting policies are two entirely separate things, because SG giveaways are personal, not political. So! I generally blacklist for the broad category of "being a jerk." Often that comes down to -isms. (Racism, sexism, classism, and some that don't fit the naming pattern like anti-LGBTQ stuff.) If the person seems more misinformed/ignorant than malicious/deliberately hurtful, I try to be more flexible.
For me, it's actually less a matter of not wanting to give people games and more of a matter of making sure I don't receive gifts from them. It's my policy to leave a sincere, enthusiastic thank you whenever I win a game. I don't really want to accidentally be put in the position of doing that with someone who thinks that I (or people I care about) are somehow stupid, subhuman, dishonest, or unworthy of respect simply for being who we are. There's no way I could leave a happy, grateful message at that point without it being fake, you know?
I'm going to guess the comment you were blacklisted for was this one: "I don't care about genders. I know what I am, and I know there are two genders - open-mindedness is good up to a certain point when it becomes tomfoolery and abuse of the existing system and democracy."
In short, that's something I'd blacklist you for normally; not because of the opinion ("there are only two genders" is something a lot of people believe because it's so entrenched culturally, and I'm happy to talk people through it when they're open to trying to understand), but because of how you framed your opinion. If you're interested in why I can break it down for you, but otherwise I'll leave this comment as-is because it's already far too many words long.
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Thank you for your input. I can see where you're coming from, however it's apparent that we disagree on the comment I wrote in the other thread. I did not want to make this thread a discussion on gender so I tiptoed around it.
Not to be judgmental or rude but your post already explained why you would blacklist me, so unless you really want to concretely elaborate I see no need for it. But in regards to it, once again, I would give the following hypothesis - you do not know my upbringing nor my lifestyle/living situation, my comment, while taking a hard stance did not personally insult any person, though it might insult a group of people that identify as something I do not accept. My comment also did not disallow for those people to express themselves or be themselves in any way except that I will personally not be subject to legally (or in any other way to be honest) - accept them as anything other than male or female. They might be insulted or triggered by that, but that doesn't limit their freedom to do anything. I am not the law, nor god. So we can go our separate ways.
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You're not being rude. :) You've stayed pretty level throughout this entire thread.
People can def still express themselves even when other people don't accept them, as long as they have the legal right to—that's pretty much a requirement if you're anything outside the norms of society. (Unless you decide to hide that you're different, when that's an option). I was speaking less about the restriction of rights and more about the personal effects of words, i.e. their potential to hurt people, how deliberate choosing to hurt them is, and why.
you do not know my upbringing nor my lifestyle/living situation
And respectfully, most people who make such comments have never talked to or tried to understand a non-binary person either. If you don't want to get into gender in this thread, let's not. But I'd urge you to consider on your own time how strong a statement it is to say that they're abusing democracy without asking to hear their perspective first.
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I can see your point of view in the second paragraph. And yes, I would like to keep this thread unrelated to the other thread, so I thank you for respecting that! :) I will also try to keep what you said in mind. Were I not very lazy and tired right now I would type (or more likely speak) an essay or attempt to voice-chat debate for I think we could debate quite a bit - but I am feeling tired af xD Add this insanely humid and hot weather on top and I'm almost dying xD
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Getting blacklisted for posting about being blacklisted is very common.
In general, I'd say that blacklisting is bad, and one of the reasons this community is worse than it once was. That said, people are free to blacklist whomever the choose, based on whatever criteria, just like they're free to whitelist for whatever reason. Most of the times I got whitelisted or blacklisted were because people agreed or disagreed with me. It's the equivalent of thumbs up/down on other sites.
And yes, that's reason enough to blacklist someone. If I like you and want to add you to my whitelist so you have a chance at special giveaways, I can dislike you and not want you to win stuff from me. It's perfectly legitimate either way. As I said, I think it's a pity that this feature exists, but as long as it does and people are using it, choosing not to gift to you because I don't like you is a good enough reason.
Personally even when I gifted (haven't done that for a few months; haven't entered giveaways for a few years) I never whitelisted or blacklisted anyone, nor made any giveaways that weren't level 0, though I did make some private giveaways, such as to the forum, and some group giveaways, to Unlucky-7 and the like. Most people on SG do pick and choose who to gift to, and even I have my criteria (I'd rather that my games go to people who haven't won a lot or those who play their wins). Blacklisting is just one way to do that, and valid as any other method.
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Thank you for your input!
Blacklisting might indeed be bad for the community. But as you said (and i agree) - people are free to do it for any reason, or for no reason at all. I do find it a more "extreme" variant of thumbs up/down, but I do agree with the notion that people you agree with tend to whitelist you and vice-versa. And yes just opening this thread made the number of blacklists I was on skyrocket but I am fine with that. On the other hand, my blacklist is also empty, i did have some people on it but after considering things and opening this thread it is now empty and so it shall remain for the time being.
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Well as im sure everyone has said already this is just a website and people have the right to blacklist anyone for anything. Whether its different views or comments or even things that may happen outside the website. In the end does it even matter though?
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Not really - but I found myself wondering why and how that happens after I had my first experience with it.
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It doesn't really matter, but most people do care what others think about them and want to be understood. It doesn't feel that good to have people blacklist you, especially when you don't know why, because it does feel harsh. But yes, in the end it doesn't matter.
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Two groups
Those who blacklisted me first because why not
That one person who spams religious slogan on giveaways (hope to win this with the help of god... or satan, toaster, potato, whatever is their fetish)
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Thank you for your input!
I was sure potato religion was extinct... you opened my eyes.
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It's something like...ehhhhhh... Similar to that TV show of the same name, but also different.
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The point is we usually treat a blacklist like some kind of penalty while in reality it is just somebody's opinion. I think we could be less defensive about it and instead acknowledge it as a kind of feedback. We can use it to improve ourselves or ignore it if we decide it won't improve us in any way.
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I don't think it's normally possible to use this as feedback, because you normally have no idea why you were blacklisted. The main thing you can learn from it is to keep your mouth shut and not share your opinions, but I don't think that's a very good lesson.
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I don't think it's normally possible to use this as feedback, because you normally have no idea why you were blacklisted.
Sometimes I just ask why I was blacklisted to see if there's a space for improvement for me. Mostly I just act as like I wasn't blacklisted at all though. I don't recall a moment when somebody who has blacklisted me, showed me no respect (for example by insulting me) so I assume we still respect each other despite the differences.
The main thing you can learn from it is to keep your mouth shut and not share your opinions, but I don't think that's a very good lesson.
Well, I feel like sometimes it's good for me to evaluate what I say. I think some people could relate. It doesn't mean we have to be silent though. I guess it also takes some self esteem to not allow ourselves to reatreat because of somebody's opinion. It's cool to remember that "we can ignore it (...) if we decide it won't improve us in any way" :)
It's a topic that I could talk for hours but work awaits :)
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I feel like sometimes it's good for me to evaluate what I say.
That's true, but I tend to do that on an ongoing basis anyway. I regularly write something, delete it and then rewrite it, often to tone it down if I felt it was too harsh. Though I tend to rephrase what I write even if I felt that what I wrote is okay, just could be said a little more clearly. I sometimes end up with meaningless sentences or broken English because of too much editing.
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Thank you for your input! I can agree with what you've said, but as ET3D noted below if you have no idea why you were blacklisted it's impossible to use it as any kind of feedback. And I do think some people would, after such an experience, choose to keep quiet and stop sharing their opinions simply so that they avoid further blacklists. But that's not something we can influence.
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I'd only blacklist someone if they were attacking anyone
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Thank you for your input. Is it hard to gauge when someone is attacking another or do you just blacklist the obvious offenders?
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On this site is either blacklists because your opinion doesn't match the majority of the site or because your opinion doesn't match mine personally.
Summing up, because blacklists because they want and/or can. Simple as that.
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Thank you for your input! I suppose that is true in most cases. I don't think that's a good approach, but I can see it's simplicity.
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You don't need to choose, when you don't actually use it
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Ooooh. Modern problems require modern solutions, I would say! :P
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Long time ago I decided I won't blacklist people. I found out that it makes them more "important" in my thoughts if I actually make the (even smallest) effort to add them to some list and that's the opposite I want for such cases. I'd rather forget them.
So I only keep a whitelist which of course isn't written is stone. Makes more sense to me to "reward" someone.
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But isn't that actually what blacklisting achieves? You put them there and never have to bother again.
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Thank you for your input! Optimistic and sensible, I think it's a good approach. Shares positive vibes I would guess.
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In the past, I blacklisted people for not acknowledging wins, accounts that had won an insane amount without giving, and those that seemed to be bots. A few months ago, I looked through my blacklist and saw that a lot of the people had been banned or hadn't been on for years, so I just cleared it. My blacklist now stands at zero.
It's still kind of annoying when there's no communication after a win, but I avoid this to some extent by making most of my giveaways level 4/5+, groups giveaways, or private giveaways in discussion posts.
When users troll a lot, post a lot of attention seeking or controversial posts I just hide them using the ESGST extension. Life's too short to get annoyed by people you'll never meet posting things on the internet! I hide the number of blacklists I'm on too, ignorance is bliss :)
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Thank you for your input! I might check out that extension, first time hearing of it.
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Honestly, the only reason I've ever blacklisted anyone is because they won one of my games and either didn't claim it or were such a huge pain when they did that I never wanted to deal with them again.
I guess I'm just not much of a blacklist kind of guy. My whitelist is pretty big though, and I do occasionally give some nice stuff as whitelist-only.
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Thank you for your input! So your blacklists were kinda based around the system, I wouldn't consider them on a personal basis/differences of opinion.
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I got blacklisted twice in the last few days and I have no idea why...but I also don't really care, I barely even enter giveaways anyway and whatever reason it may be that I've been blacklisted, if it's for a good reason, then sure go ahead, if it's for no reason whatsoever, sure go ahead ^^
Also my blacklist has been empty for years.
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Thank you for your input! I don't dare imagine what the reason is, but as someone already said here, I find it's like a blessing in disguise. And in the end, certainly, it doesn't matter at all :D
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I used to blacklist people that were just being dicks in general. But I just removed all my blacklist because I think they should get a second chance. I myself am blacklisted by 31 people. I used to break some rules I think and got so many at once. Made me comment way less. Haven't gotten a single blacklist in 2 years. But who knows, maybe someone will blacklist me now.
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Thank you for your input!
Yes, you just might get blacklisted now, which would be unfortunate considering your 2-year streak. But I dislike that you felt disinclined to comment on the forum after you blacklisted - I can understand it obviously, but I dislike that sort of feeling one experiences that he no longer feels the need/urge to participate in a community. It's not a good thing in my opinion.
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Well I guess you're right. But it's just that I hate to get blacklisted. Even though it shouldn't matter that much, it just doesn't feel right. Still didn't get unblacklisted by those people, even after 2 years. But it's different for everyone when they remove their blacklist. Some of them don't remove it at all which I can understand though.
However I recently started to use the forum a bit more. But I did barely comment for a long while.
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I can understand your point of view. And I do hope you post if you feel like posting and don't let such things you cannot really influence get to you! :)
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You obviously need to blacklist and ignore and ban and otherwise remove all opinions that differs from your own, otherwise you could not build your perfect little echochamber.
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chamber..chamber...ber...
As I've already said many times, someone said it first, I find that a blessing in disguise. Such people aren't even open to any kind of debate most of the time so it just saves you time I suppose.
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Meh, I gain at least one when I am not "progressive enough"
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Thank you for your input! I guess that's how it usually goes, but again - blessing in disguise.
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I've only seen one person that deserves to be blacklisted... threatening with violence is a no go in my book.
I tend to find the rest of the stuff that goes on here as... Meh, who cares.
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Thank you for your input!
That's quite a red whitelist you got there :P A bit intimidating. But very nice of you at the same time.
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529, 847???? I thought that my 290 whitelist was too much. You are truly nice people
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...can we even call them a culture? XD... But yeah, that's how it usually goes :D
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I usually don't blacklist people, so far I've only done it 3 times, during those almost 5 years of my stay here. I can usually just accept that everyone has different opinions on everything, hence I don't just instantly blacklist people who have different beliefs than me. However, when I see someone who is being excessively intolerant, purposefully abstains from trying to understand any opinion different than theirs while saying theirs is superior to any other opinion in existence, and/or even just goes and starts to insult anyone who does not agree, I use my blacklist. I also know it matters next to nothing, but it somehow helps me preserve my inner peace that when I create a giveaway, it has more chance to get to a good, non-toxic person.
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Thank you for your input! If you adhere to your words it seems reasonable enough! :)
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Here's the thing - you could read some "controversial" topics recently, and of course, ignoring them would change nothing, but I noted that after expressing what most would consider an unpopular opinion/stance on a matter I find myself on quite a few blacklists, and find it somewhat amusing. One could say my stance was conservative and closed-minded sure, but is that reason enough (obviously one does not need any actual reason, but for the sake of discussion) to blacklist someone - just because you disagree with something they said? It's not that important, I just find it curious. I also realize that this might be another of those "controversial" threads, but, hey, free speech? I'm also interested in the POV of others of course, otherwise I wouldn't even ask.
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