I don't play co-op because I don't like depending on others to help me complete my games. Because of this, I often find myself sitting on a bench, bemused, as I read and listen to peoples' complaints of toxic game communities. I'm bemused because I get frustrated at games and I have indeed rage-quit in the past, but I've never said any of the things to another human being that people claim others have said to them, even if I was angry with someone online. I've been on the Internet for awhile, but it still shocks me that people can type or say certain things to absolute strangers and feel justified in doing that.

I don't know. I guess I ask this question because game companies are pushing co-op now more than ever because they know that by design co-op forces you to look at other peoples' load outs and special weapons and skins and whatever and be blown away (metaphorically and literally) by their majesty, and it just encourages you to spend money in order to match them, outdo them, or simply to not get slamdunked into the trash every single time. Yet while these companies are stroking their fingers with glee, they seem to lack the interest in monitoring gamer behavior. So many games devolve into having toxic communities and with despicable player bases who grow artificially jaded and cynical from increased exposure to these neutral evil hellspawn.

5 years ago

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Is this what life is? To get frustrated at a game and spit vitriol through our mics like animals?

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Yes, the opportunity for PVP/co-op/multiplayer ensures that it will soon be ruined by angry losers
No, the supposed 'toxicity' within these game communities is overblown
Yes, but these tendencies can easily be curbed with a zero-tolerance policy on bad behavior
No, but the nature of the game (i.e. difficulty, elapsed time for dungeon runs) amplifies or reduces these tendencies

Of course. All communities are made of people. The same is valid for any other random group pushed together by some outside source.

5 years ago
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Somehow, I've ended up in a community of robots, feral dogs, drunken meerkats, lovecraftian entities, and one really pissed off chincilla.

All communities are made of people.

My, your tolerance and open-mindness is refreshing!
Let me just direct Chu'Agthul the Consumer and Chinny the Chinchilla over to your place then.
'cause, frankly, I'm tired of their nonsense.
DAMMIT, THOSE DIPS WERE FOR EVERYONE, CHU'AGTHUL.

Well, I'll still take that community over one made up of random humans. That's where the true nastiness comes out.

5 years ago
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Anonymity will always give rise to jackasses.

5 years ago
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That was the leading theory before social media came along and far more jackasses began their rise showing their face, name and every other detail nobody ever wanted to know publicly.

5 years ago
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Yup. That was going to be my response too.

5 years ago
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Fine, let me rephrase. Lack of face to face encounters and knowing they won't get punched in the face gives rise to jackasses. That said though, plenty of toxic people in gaming wouldn't share personal details, so anonymity is still a large factor.

5 years ago
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Yes, there are games were you can hardly find flamers. You know, I installed HoTs like a week ago and in literally all my matchups, 0 flamers.

I come back to lol and flamers everywhere.

5 years ago
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If I had to choose between having to press the 'Mute' button myself and having a nosy nanny log every in-game chat occasionally banning innocent people for using the word 'singer' because of overly protective wilcard filters (zero tolerance on using the N-word and all that) - just give me a mute button and off you go.

5 years ago
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I agree. Zero tolerance usually also makes no room for context of a conversation and who's high moral standard of "zero tolerance" will be forced upon someone...maybe they've got different viewpoints of what is considered "hate speech".

Zero Tolerance aint the way to go, but I feel some reporting and action taken on bad behavior may be worthwhile, still a huge problem on who decides it was bad or not...

Just mute em.

5 years ago
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I mean, there's always going to be some toxic players but I've played many multiplayer games where the communities are mostly positive. Smaller communities tend to be more positive, and the more competitive the more toxic in my experience. So ranked / ladder games are often more toxic vs casual playlists.

5 years ago
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i used to love playing coop games and played a few mmos in the past but i really hated that people would rage if you deviated even the slightest from meta strats. like homie, i just want to play a game and enjoy it i dont need someone micromanaging my play style.

5 years ago
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That's why it's best to only play with friends and family. I've given up on playing with strangers since the L4D2 days.

5 years ago
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Sadly, for that you need friends and/or family and not everyone has those and so you are either forced to skip a game all together or play with randoms, for me that means skipping a game if it's forced multiplayer.

5 years ago
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The correct answer is:

No, the supposed 'toxicity' within these game communities is overblown

I mean, maybe the overlap in target audience is not that large here, but have you ever participated in, just for example, any sports in any club/association or something? Do you really think that this is any different?

5 years ago
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I admit my knowledge in that field may be limited, but from any real-life association I've ever spectated, nobody has ever come close to expressing the level of toxicity that you see daily on the internet. Sure there exists assholes in real life too but generally people at least bother to act civilized when they are physically near each other. On the internet, people almost do the opposite, and even those who behave decently in real life often turn to trolls and worse when shielded from direct contact.

The alternative is assuming that what you say is true and people in real life clubs/associations are really as toxic behind closed doors as I've seen people on the internet behave. If that is true, that would actually be even more disturbing (as that would mean that people are generally toxic everywhere).
Claiming that internet toxicity is overblown leads me to believe that you either have extremely tough skin or actually haven't experienced how bad it gets quite frequently, especially in competitive multiplayer communities.

5 years ago
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I used to play goalkeeper for a local team, and in the span of 45 minutes I'd easily hear insults thrown at my kit colour, my playstyle, my dads, my wives, my pets, my cacti - ranging from them just being sh-te by default to them only being worthy of brain cancer. That's part of the game. In some weird way, there's a part of me that actually doesn't want that part of the game gone.

5 years ago
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Late reply but your cacti? Low blows, man.

5 years ago
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Guess it takes a real prick to go for something really prickly. :j

5 years ago
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Nah, communities, start, continue and always will be toxic.

5 years ago
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that's why single-players have always been the best games =P

5 years ago
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A gaming community without proper moderation / penalties, is much like a garden without someone to pull the weeds. Good sportsmanship and a mindset of having a mutual laugh can spread, sure, but not nearly as fast or as resiliently as anger or frustration where mechanics are abused or the immature continue to provoke. This goes doubly so for when your rewards are tied to your teams performance.

5 years ago
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It sounds more like you're talking about team pvp games than co-op games. Dedicated co-op games are still generally more oriented towards local play or direct connections, with any potential pick-up group options being recognized as a significantly subpar option to teaming up with someone you know [unlike in team pvp games, where personal skill can better help make up for poor teamwork, making online groups feel a bit more of a natural option].

By the time PUGs start becoming a real consideration for co-op, you're usually in the realm of MMOs, and those are fairly inclined towards putting in the effort to make such groupings work out without major issues and, typically, offer suitable controls for avoiding or managing problematic teammates.

As far as more general considerations, and especially as far as team pvp goes, you're looking at "inherently high odds of toxicity from random humans" being combined with "shoddy community management". Any game with decent community management offers controls, filters, sorts, penalties, and so forth to manage toxicity. While that never manages to avoid it entirely, it does fairly reliably change "regular occurances of extreme toxicity" to "rare occurances of passing toxicity".

In other words, it's the rather significant difference between "oh gods, this game's groupings are an awful trainwreck and the developers shold be kicked in sensitive areas" and "meh, social interactions can occasionally suck". In summary, where people are complaining about toxicity, they're almost always actually complaining about a game's poor management or, in the case of co-op, their own lack of gaming-inclined friends to rely on [in place of the strangers they're grouping up with instead].

Beyond that, it'd just be the usual "ugh, dealing with humans is a pain" that is pretty common for any form of social interaction involving humans [especially circumstances involving power dynamics or the need to rely on those other individuals in some way]. An "I don't want my games to stress me the same way my job does" mentality is pretty reasonable, though that may really just be an indication that the person complaining should be looking for a less stressful alternative for their gaming attentions.

5 years ago*
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I really haven't experienced this. maybe because i do not get personally involved. If you're playing multiplayer with random people, you don't have to chat with them.
I have PTT setup on all games and only talk necessary.

5 years ago
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5 years ago
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"There was no violence, just bibles and kittens" - it must be ironic...

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5 years ago
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Well I play league of legends and it is pretty common to see someone wishing some other guy gets cancer or his whole family dies or threatens to kill them himself after losing a game. Also based on my experience in that game, whenever it is a loss people tend to find someone to blame it on. Unfortunately toxicity triggers more toxicity. It becomes a little better when the players are older or more mature.

In your second paragraph you did a good job explaining why companies are doing this and why they won't care about players' actions. No one would spend thousands of dollars on a single player game but people do that on multiplayer games. Even though it is completely crazy to spend so much on a game, companies know well how to push people to do so. Lords mobile is a good example for that ;)

5 years ago*
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For many years I played on a MUD with a very good community, but it was a very small community.

Play on anything with a large playerbase and you are going to run into annoying people, no way around it.

5 years ago
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Gamers are toxic people

5 years ago*
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that's why i play SP only
although internet connection are also contribute alot :p

5 years ago
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The only co-op titles I ever play are pve only. The idea of pvp co-op just ruins the experience along with that sucks out the joy of the game for me personally.

I play to have fun, not to git gud.

5 years ago
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Then there is content like Raids and such in MMOs where elitist are surely to pop up, wanting you to have everything they expect from the METAthis or METAthat. Just play with friends or a SO, you will end up having a ton more fun in the long run in MMOs when it comes to that.

5 years ago
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In my experience, the toxicity is overblown. I usually play single player games, but at times I have played MMOs, online mobile games, and various coop games online.

For MMOs, it really just depends on what kind of guild / group you join. If you join one that's passionate about being competitive in guild rankings / whatever, then there's probably going to be toxicity. But if you join some middling guild where people just want to have fun, everyone is usually very supportive, tolerant of mistakes, and friendly. This is basically the same on mobile games. When I've played MMOs, I've always had the most fun exploring, helping people newer than myself, and doing things very inefficiently.

For general coop games, it depends on how competitive it is, like other people say. There are plenty of laid-back people playing minecraft, terraria, don't starve together, etc., but far fewer playing rocket league, fortnite, overwatch, and other MOBA games. It's part of the culture, I guess. Even if you are playing "unranked" games in something like rocket league, people are still very judgemental / cruel to each other.

One game that I loved years ago was Worms Armageddon, and the online community was all about roping vs. traditional play. If you enjoyed playing with the ninja rope, the community was almost never toxic, even if you weren't very good. But, if you didn't know that using the rope was the expectation, people would often get hostile or impatient. It's all about the culture and expectation of the community, ultimately. By far, most of my experiences have not been toxic in online games.

P.S.: If you want to play local or "couch" co-op games online, Parsec is pretty nice, as long as your network connection is good enough.

5 years ago
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You didn't have toxicity to nearly the same extent when private dedicated servers were the norm, as admins could simply kick/ban users who were being assmunches. Not to mention the grace required to maintain a good standing in a reliable server with good ping, rotation and players. Then Xbox Live happened opening the multiplayer world to swarms of angry, horny 11 year olds and their headsets, who couldn't be policed because of the inherent dev/pub-owned or P2P nature of the MP ecosystem that persists to this day because muh live services. Yes some games allow the players to vote to kick obnoxious players but that itself often becomes an abusive tool, and for some games it actually breaks the game (DOTA, anyone?). And players simply will not be as motivated or as effective as an admin. I haven't played any competitive MP games with randos in a while, the latest I remember being TF2 and Bad Company 2. My experiences there were that assholes were extremely rare and temporary exceptions rather than the norm. In fact, I met many good friends and regular game buddies on particularly well managed servers.

The efforts of the likes of Riot and Blizzard to detoxify their player bases are all for fucking nought because their entire multiplayer model precludes effective asshole management and rehabilitation. Toxicity isn't a global problem for a game, it's a recurrence of many smaller localized problems. Localized problems require localized solutions. Bring back private servers ffs.

Oh and by the way private servers are a solution to many more problems than just obnoxious players. It allows a game to survive past developer capability/interest, allows game availability to naturally distribute to where the players actually are globally (I feel your pain Aussies), allows modding (which, lest we forget, are where CS and DOTA originally came from), allows true grassroots competitive scenes, and with technology available these days may not even require a master server to use (blockchain?). Oh, and it allows short-circuiting the live service bullshit. When hats came out for TF2 there quickly were servers that allowed players to select and wear them without actually having acquired the things, and it was all the better for it because players were focused on expressing themselves while playing the fucking game instead of collecting virtual garbage.

5 years ago*
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Don't play with a lot of strangers and/or block/report the ones that don't know normal behavior.
How much you can do depends on the game you play.
A good game, in my view, do something against "bad behavior", a bad game don't.
And i reward good games with my money and bad games not. Easy solution.

5 years ago
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too many kids with anonymity will grant you toxicity.
but the smaller communities tend to be nice and helpful.
also having an entry barrier and report mechanics helps, if a kid can create a new account/act freely then he won't care about penalties.

5 years ago
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^ This.

In my experience, those who have been raised properly are rarely ever toxic, in a game or otherwise. Such people tend to be "older" because previous generations were taught "good manners." and personal accountability. While it is possible to encounter a well-behaved kid, nowadays, this has become the exception rather than the norm. I expect one reason for this shift in society is the amount of time and effort required to teach good behavior. Many of today's parents are either unable or unwilling to make such a commitment. Even if the child wants to be "good," he or she faces an uphill struggle with limited support.

5 years ago
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As long as the small community does not turn elitist, which is sadly quite common as well.

5 years ago
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It's not inevitable, as long as the community polices itself a bit. An example of this that I encountered was Ultima Online, which had a decently sized community built around the server I was on, the level of toxic behaviour was rather low. Not saying that there were never any toxic people around, but most of the time, the toxic people ended up being rather lonely quite quickly, and would quit.

Certain games are far worse than others when it comes to toxic behaviour. Competitive games with long matches tend to be a lot worse than ones with shorter matches, for an example. When I played DOTA 2 I encountered toxic players far more often than in HOTS. Also a low barrier to entry tend to result in more toxic behaviour.

5 years ago*
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There are many more nice people playing online games than toxic people. Toxic people are just more vocal, that's all.

5 years ago
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Until the Korean model becomes worldwide, yes. Until people have to register their ID number for a web service, meaning a ban means they are out for life for real, they will feel empowered to act like assholes.

5 years ago
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this is too much, it cool and i like it. but i also like my privacy

5 years ago
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