Do you want this feature?
Obligatory comment about there being some possible exploits to this system
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There is an exploit to the system if you enable this!
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lol, just as i was gonna say i see no reason why this would fail as long as it was only to extent the time and not shrink it. but...... now jatan got me rethinking it.
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I thought jatan was just kidding? I fail to see any potential exploit from this, since it's something you can already do, just manually by deleting the giveaway and creating a new one with the new end date (you'll only lose a slot).
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agree, i think it was a joke too, but it did still make me rethink... i still fail to see a flaw in it also. =)
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I'm sure there's an exploit! Somewhere!
Anyone? Anyone?
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Well OP didn't specify a one time only edit, soooo ... the unending giveaway is born!
Profit?
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You can basically create a never-ending giveaway by continuing to extend the end time ?
That'd be a new way to create a fake GA!
nah. that won't work if the rule stays in place that the maximum end time is 30 days from start time
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I heard it as well, still trying to find them.
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Not really an exploit, but I can imagine some people joining specific gibs due to them being for example, 1 hour long, knowingly that they wouldn't get as many entries and there being a high chance of winning. If the giveaway creator would be able to extend that time later, they have already gotten my entry due to having it be a 1 hour gib, but I maybe wouldn't have joined it if it was a 24 hour gib (which he could've made it). Ofcourse, this is a minor issue that only a few people would actually have a problem with. Probably people with few points that join many gibs and that only join stuff that they have (relatively) high chances of winning on (Not me. I'm always at 300 points :3)
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People could get a notification if a giveaway they were in has been altered and then decide to continue in it or not.
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I have one... If the 30 day limit is not enforced from start date but instead, the end date one could effectively keep a giveaway running infinitely.
Much Exploit... Such Wow... in all seriousness it is just a convenience that I don't really care about. So have it your way.®
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I wouldn't call that an "exploit" though. I would use it a lot for puzzles as well.
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Do I want this feature? No, I don't need it. Do I have anything against it? No again, as far as I see - it will do no harm.
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Your answer kinda makes me wish I could change the poll to "Would you be okay with this feature?" (when are you going to allow editing polls, cg?).
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I'm sure there must be a possible exploit somewhere but I fail to see it right now. It could be useful to end a leaked giveaway immediately though.
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Yep, that's another situation where it would be useful. Everyone says that, but I have yet to see someone present a valid exploit.
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I had CG change the time on a Bad Rats giveaway
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making GAs just to farm cv is the first mistake, second would be messing up the ga end date.
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Considering SG has a CV system, making GAs to farm CV is no mistake.
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well, that's a really sad way to see sg, like people who come here just to win.
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It wouldn't have to be if there wasn't a CV system in place, but unfortunately it forces people to see it that way when it excludes them from certain giveaways.
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It would not be fair for the people who already entered the GAs, because the length of GAs is one of important parameters that people can use to decide if they enter it or not. To make it shorter would be ok, but to make it longer would not.
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But what about people who intend to enter it later on because now they have no points?
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So to make it easier for you to win would be okay, but otherwise would not? And also, people could get a notification when a giveaway they've entered has been altered, so they could decide whether to stay or not.
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To set shorter time would not hurt anyone from the users who entered, to set longer time would hurt all the people who entered.
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Like EvilBudgie said, to set shorter time would hurt anyone who hasn't entered, but was planning on doing so. It has to be a 2-way street. And saying it would hurt all the people is wrong, because I'm sure some entrants wouldn't be affected by it.
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yeah i said a long version of the opposite, but submitting comment it vanished into the internet void =(
longer/extending can be very helpful to get the last 2-3entries needed for the 5entry req for CV.. personally idc about cv and have many end all the time short of the 5entries, but i see others delete theres all the time just because they didn't have the 5entries.. to have the option to just extend it a few hours or even days wouldn't really hurt if all those that were entered into it got a notifier or something that the time was adjusted..
but shorter/shrinking could be used in a douchey way by essentially killing the GA the moment 5entries is met, when several people may of had intent to join in on it, but saw they had plenty of time left to do so.
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Yeah, it could help group or whitelist GAs, you are right.
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Sorry, that might have been me editing the thread. If I do that when someone is about to post, their comment flies off to Narnia. This is something that should be fixed, in my opinion.
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oh np, it was just about a wall before. the newly typed one doesn't look as bad as the first one and still contained all the same points. xD
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but shorter/shrinking could be used in a douchey way by essentially killing the GA the moment 5entries is met, when several people may of had intent to join in on it, but saw they had plenty of time left to do so.
Maybe setting a limit to say your new end time must be at least one hour after the current time (same rule when creating in the first place), that would help prevent this?
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hypothetical: what if i wake up in the morning, see a really nice GA i want to enter into but spent all my points but saw it ended 12hours from now and head to work. 4hours into my shift i take a lunchbreak and try to go enter into it because points should of built-up by then and i find it had already ended. my odds were so good too because it ended with only 7people entered into it, but i missed out..
i mean no system is perfect, and the same could be reversed for longer.. - specifically wanted to join the one that ended in 2hours instead of 24hours, then you don't login until 25hours later and see the one you joined was extended for 3weeks and you missed out on the one that ended an hour earlier.
update/addon:
i guess i just see more benifit from the extension side only, and to much potential loss or like i said earlier "doucheyness" on shrinking. not that everybody who shrunk it would instantly be a "douche" but i think there would still be too many.. extending it only does harm in the "i didn't enter both GA's, only the one" area really.
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No, I agree. I don't think it would solve the issue, just help a little. ;)
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yeah, any change at all to the system and somebody won't like it. but i think the harm is minimal with extending GAs, and really idc even if they did allow shrinking. but that one may piss off more people is all i'm saying.
im unemployed and live behind the screen during the day, so wouldn't really miss anything
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Someone could write a bot and always add one minute to the end date, essentially keeping a giveaway on the front page forever. Or make a 50-copy giveaway and always add one hour, it will be on the top (even if rotated) until someone deletes it.
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and here we have the real exploit - it makes it easier to fish for maximum number of entries!
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Legit, but if we really go with the original idea of messing something up, a single change couldn't make much problem, could it?
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within the minimum and maximum limits of 1 hour and 30 days, of course
And there could be a limit to allow it only one time or something, so this is still not an exploit.
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That would need a separate counter or flag on every single giveaway made to check if its end date has been modified or not. With cg having multiple entries on the announcement forum on how much tinkering the database needed to not kill the servers all the time, I am not sure he could be convinced to expand the records even further.
In principle though, I agree,a one-time change to fix something messed up during creation would be nice.
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I'm not sure he could be convinced to do anything. When was the last time he took any suggestion from us? He can't even allow us to use IndieGala gift links. I'm just putting the suggestion out there, but I highly doubt it will ever be implemented.
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Yes, I support this! But make it so that you can only change the end date of your giveaway once, to avoid trolls keeping Bad Rats on the front page forever (and make all other rules apply, so no giveaways that lasts for multiple months, plus, you can't change the giveaway's end date to less than an hour from when you edit it).
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It would be really usable for exploiting. You could, for example, farm whitelists with this feature.
- Make a GA of AAA game and set the end in 2 hours (GAs are much more visible when there is just little time).
- Get tons of whitelists for giving away such a great game.
- Before the end, set the duration for another 2 hours and farm again.
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or just set the GA for a long period of time and get WL that way? why would you need to set it for short times?
also would people BL you instead if you get lengthening it
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(GAs are much more visible when there is just little time).
If you make 2 GAs and you set one for 1 month and the other for 2 hours, after the two hours the first one willl have, for example, just 30 entries and the other 400.
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Oh, no! There will be surely some exploits of this feature!
Yeah, like CV system is perfect. Not to mention site rules which aren't clear even ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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On the other hand it would be nice if GA creator wouldn't change duration of their giveaway over and over again, endlessly I^v^I
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Already added that to the OP in the update. It would be allowed only once automatically (more than that only through support). And the 30 days limit would also prevent that.
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It would be nice to include that possibility for giveaways with less than 5 entries. Yes.
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beside already mentioned exploit of endless extending your GA for most exposure not an exploit but shitty thing for normal users - when short on points you usually plan what to enter ahead. Lkike for example if I have 100p left and there's 3 AAA games I'd like to enter I will spend 60p on one ending in 2 hours, then wait for another 20p to regenerate, enter one ending in 10 hours, wait for another 60p and enter one ending tommorow. But creators of GA 2 and 3 may decide that they already got enough entries to get CV and cfinish GAs 2 and 3 in 10 minutes. On one hand it's their right on another hand it really screws over any planning regarding SG entering.
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Already mentioned exploit of endlessly extending your GA has been debunked with the idea of allowing it only one time automatically (more than that through support). And yes, I often do planning about entering giveaways later when I'm out of points, but the giveaways are the creator's to do whatever they want with them, so this system wouldn't change that. And the same way you would get a notification if a giveaway you were in has had the end date altered, maybe there could also be a watchlist feature for giveaways you're interested in so that when they get edited you receive a notification as well.
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for me it overcomplicates the system - now it's easy - list of GAs categorized by ending date ascending, additional filters like group, new, levels etc but all in all still the same easy principle. Adding functions like watchlist etc makes SG overcomplicated for my opinion, like management simulator.
Another possible exploitation - right now maximum timer for GAs is 30 days, what if 1 min b4 GA ends I set it up to end in 30 days again? I make 2 months long GA ;p
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I only suggested the watchlist for people who plan their entries, but it's not necessary to the system - people can do whatever they want with their giveaways, you're not entitled to enter a giveaway just because you were planning on doing so later.
I already mentioned that the time range would remain the same (1 hour to 30 days from the start date), so again, that exploit is debunked.
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where do I say or even imply I am entitled? I simply said why I dpeersonally don;t like this idea, how it would make things harder for me personally, did so in calm and civilized manner, presented my arguments and what? Seriously revil - the moment I disagree with you on something, even if I state it';s my PERSONAL feeling, you gotta immediatelly turn aggro mode, attack me, say how entitled I am etc? All arguments you can present regarding what I wrote is how entitled I am, how I want to force others to do sth they don't want with their Gas etc (while all I said is that it would make really easy and plai system more complicated). Second argument you won't even address?
Then ok,, note taken, will not comment on any of your threads just in case I would say something dear princess may disagree on with and will start calling me names.
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I wasn't referring to you specifically, I was talking about people who plan their entries in general (myself included). And when did I attack you? I'm presenting my arguments in a calm and civilized manner as well. I was just trying to suggest something that would make this system better for you. What second argument? I thought I addressed everything you said.
You:
for me it overcomplicates the system - now it's easy - list of GAs categorized by ending date ascending, additional filters like group, new, levels etc but all in all still the same easy principle. Adding functions like watchlist etc makes SG overcomplicated for my opinion, like management simulator.
Me:
I only suggested the watchlist for people who plan their entries, but it's not necessary to the system - people can do whatever they want with their giveaways, you're not entitled to enter a giveaway just because you were planning on doing so later.
The basic idea of the system wouldn't overcomplicate anything at all. Only the notification system would, and it's not necessary for the system to work.
You:
Another possible exploitation - right now maximum timer for GAs is 30 days, what if 1 min b4 GA ends I set it up to end in 30 days again? I make 2 months long GA ;p
Me:
I already mentioned that the time range would remain the same (1 hour to 30 days from the start date), so again, that exploit is debunked.
So tell me, what argument did I miss?
And I didn't call you any names ever.
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Adding functions like watchlist etc makes SG overcomplicated for my opinion, like management simulator.
SG: The Meta Game!
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Get ready for my never ending gib:
100 copies of mafia 3 that never end >:)
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ok, real exploit. sort of.
what about people entering GA for saving points - it is been done.
then the end date changes?
also, what if you are out of points, and you enter the GA ending soon, but those that end later get moved to end soon and you miss them?
anyway, i don't see the benefits of this.
either delete the GA, or if invite only, don't link anywhere
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That's not an exploit, no one would benefit from that. And I already suggested a notification system to keep people aware of which giveaways they entered or plan to enter have been altered. The benefits of this are right there in the OP and some others have been mentioned around in the thread. Deleting the GA after there have already been entrants can be a hassle (and it would also eat your points, if you're so worried about points). And not linking it anywhere doesn't work when there have already been entrants.
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But you can enter in few GAs that will end in 2 weeks, as you're going on vacation for a week. And you come back to see that you won game you didn't want, bc creator shortened GA and you weren't able to withdraw your entry.
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If you didn't want the game, why did you enter in the first place? Also, there is a reroll feature for that.
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I said it in reply to Tiny - storing few points when there is like flood of 100p GAs from 1st tier of HB, to enter at some point into flood of GAs I'd like to win. Now it's possible and unharmful, with date change it's be one big mess.
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Like I said in my reply to you, it's your problem. You're the one exploiting the system by storing points in giveaways you don't want to win.
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It's not a "hassle" at all. I deleted 2 gibs a while back when I accidentally made them outside the group I intended, and the process was trivial.
Asking for a new feature that would require database changes and a potentially complex new notification system? Just so you can use it to make obscure puzzles? Are you serious?
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Your case has nothing to do with this. Yours was a mess up in the target group of the giveaway, the entrants would be different. I'm talking about the end date of a giveaway, where the entrants would be the same. Completely different things. If you want to extend the end date of a giveaway and want to preserve all of the current entrants, for example, you would have to let each of them know that you have to delete the giveaway and will create a new one, because most people will miss it if you just delete it without saying anything. So yes, it's a trivial process, but it's still a hassle.
And uh oh, suggestion police is here. Don't make assumptions about me when you don't know a single fucking thing about me. There are a lot of occasions this would be helpful in. I could care less about giveaways from my puzzles ending with less than few entries.
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Seriously, your argument makes ABSOLUTELY no sense. You're talking about 10s of hours of development, testing, and bug fixing, not to mention new support issues, to handle a niche case that, realistically, has very little effect on anyone.
Either you're completely out of touch, or this is really about the puzzle aspect.
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A niche case that doesn't have an effect on anyone, but 102 people would want this feature? Did you read the thread to see the plenty of occasions this would be helpful in? Your argument is the one that makes absolutely no sense. And yes, I know a lot of work would be involved to implement this, but do you seriously believe cg will ever implement this or anything ever suggested in this section? And, on top of everything, if anyone should decide whether or not this would be a good feature, it should be cg. Not you, not anyone else. Only cg. So fuck off out of my thread.
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102 people is a tiny fraction of the SG community. And even if all of them actually used it, that still doesn't translate to actual VALUE. And, as a practical matter, you don't get to decide who can comment on your public threads.
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You are also a tiny fraction of the SG community, so don't assume anything you say has value either and is always 100% correct. Get a grip.
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Yeah. I store points sometimes in 3 - 4 week long GAs, so I'd end up with winning GAs I don't want. And ask creator to make rerolls, so extra work for support.
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Well, that's your problem. You're risking losing those points anyway if those giveaways get deleted.
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sadly enough, people actually do that...
i only pointed out that fact. i hardly enter GA (that said, just won banner saga a few hours ago, YAY! )
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I see it as an unnecessary complexity to add to the system. There is minimal impact in the already present, simple alternative - delete the giveaway with incorrect information and create a new giveaway. I believe there is even a selection for that as a valid reason in the Delete Giveaway request form.
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The current alternative is not so simple, and might piss those people who had entered the giveaway off (once I deleted a giveaway and quite a few people got mad at me for their points - one even left a negative feedback on my profile). Having the ability to shorten or extend the end date of a giveaway would be much simpler. And apart from the notification system, I don't see how it would add an unnecessary complexity to add to the system.
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I was not arguing that it was friendly or amenable to all, just technically the simplest solution, with the least potential difficulties for all involved.
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It's definitely not. You have to delete the giveaway, then create another one. Everyone who entered the other one loses their points and has to enter the new one. That's not simple. Simple is clicking a button on an already running giveaway and selecting a new end date with all the entrants remaining where they are.
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It is one thing to remove a contest entirely due to a mistake or unforeseen problem, it is quite another to change the rules once it has started; it removes fairness.
I believe someone once called the restriction on changing giveaways a design "to prevent people jerking one another around."
I would like to continue with the site as is rather than introduce user-controlled giveaway changes.
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I'm talking about a single user-controlled giveaway change here, but okay, I already tried to suggest everything I could to make the system fair (only allow one edition automatically - more than that only through support, keep the 1 hour and 30 days time range from the start date, and make it so that the creator loses a slot every time they edit the end date of a giveaway), so there's no point in continuing to discuss this.
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If giveaway gets deleted, those who had entered it should receive back the points spent. That's essentially the only issue with "delete and recreate the giveaway" process currently.
Shouldn't be that hard to implement, for example: script that automaticly clicks 'remove entry' for everyone before deleting the giveaway.
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same could be said for adding an "extend time" adjustment script xD - looks about the same level of ease to implement to me. but instead with the extend feature, you don't have to worry about getting the 4entries you had +1 more, you just simply need the +1 more xD
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I only see two substantial reasons to change an end date.
First: After you messed it up. In that case we could allow a short time frame of some minutes to fix that, though there already is a review of giveaways before you publish them.
Second: Too few entries. So if there are less than 5 entries for private GAs, you could be allowed to give it some more time.
I don't see why otherwise a "change of mood", should be a reason to mess around with end dates. There doesn't need to be an exploit, to make it a nuisance.
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Third: Someone leaked the link of the giveaway and you don't want to delete it, but want to stop any more people from entering it. You could then shorten the end date.
Fourth: You will be unable to purchase the gift within the 7 days time frame after the giveaway is over or something turned up and you will be away for that time. You could then extend the end date to give you the time you need to obtain the gift / return.
And many more...
Why limit the system only for a few minutes after the giveaway is up and when it has less than 5 entries? Each person can have their own reasons, so yes, a "change of mood" should be enough reason to allow us to edit the end dates. And you do realize this is already possible to do, right? This system would only make it easier.
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Yes, I do realize that it is already possible. But I also do realize that there is a penalty for that action and I think that it is appropriate that messing around with end dates shouldn't be made too cheap and easy.
With the current system you have to consider if your problem is worth the price, which balances its usage. Your suggestion would grant a wild card for every single giveaway, for no other reason than being in the mood to do so.
Thus I'd support a limited adaption, that leaves those "on a whim" scenarios out, just as explained.
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Maybe on each change you make you'd lose a spot then, just like you would upon deletion. That would make it balanced.
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well, cg never implemented stuff that got 100% votes on yes.
but i do wish you good luck... i still don't see the benefits only me probably, but the exploits are few and minor. you never know how cg thinks ;)
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This will never be implemented, or anything suggested in this section. Mark my words.
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Sometimes I create a giveaway and then I see that I messed up the end date, or I just want to let it run a bit sooner or longer for some reason (i.e. the giveaway didn't get enough entries to give me CV yet), but then there are already entrants, so I can't just delete the giveaway and create a new one (technically I can, but it would be too much of a hassle). So it would be nice if we could edit the end date of a giveaway, within the minimum and maximum limits of 1 hour and 30 days, of course. I believe this would be really helpful.
Update: The minimum and maximum limits would be from the start date, obviously, and you would be allowed to edit only once automatically (having to go through support if you needed to edit it more times), to prevent people from editing it forever and possibly always keeping the giveaway on the front page. And you would lose a slot every time you edited the end date of a giveaway, to keep things fair (some situations could be slot-losing free).
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