I see these ask threads and people tend to reply with all trade threads being in the trade forums, but is it really "against" the rules to ask about advice on safe trading in the discussion forums? All the trade threads are really just trades and trades and then that thread gets washed away fast assuming you would even ask there.
edit:
I would also only deal with people with really high feedback if selling a lot of keys at once. I've seen a few people do the "YOU MUST SAY I WILL NOT ASK FOR A REFUND" in the note section but I really wonder if that is going to stop anything. If you already send the money as a gift, I don't see anyone getting anything back anyway.
You have 49 tradeback with a -1 (whatever that is), so most people with lower feedback will end up going first anyway. Most people going higher really shouldn't try to screw you either.. just make sure you are dealing with the person in question. Make sure the person interested is, too, somehow.
M a k e. S u r e.
Comment has been collapsed.
Usually making a trade discussion thread here seems to get the replies that all trade related discussion should be in the trade section. Asking about advice I doubt, but who knows..
edit: I'd also add advice in your topic because it looks very misleading (even if it's bait). It looks like you want to sell them here and you should make it very clear since it looks like a "trade". Just my own opinion, though.
double edit: actually, I'd probably just ignore it really. Adding advice would make your topic more clear, though.
Comment has been collapsed.
I usually check this thread for someone buying/selling http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/forum/27-team-fortress-2-cash-trading/
EDIT: Check their backpack.tf trust before trading.
Comment has been collapsed.
Also most people will look at this page for your trade reputation http://backpack.tf/profiles/76561198111593891
Comment has been collapsed.
Not sure of the exact quantity of the fees.
"Goods and services – Purchase payments: There's no fee to use PayPal to purchase goods or services. However, if you receive money for goods or services (such as from selling an item on eBay), the fee for each transaction is 2.9% plus $0.30 USD of the amount you receive." From PayPal's website.
Some people will send the funds as a gift, but some prefer to put it through as 'sale' rather than gift.
Comment has been collapsed.
There is no protection for digital items, really, which is why people generally go for Friends and Family because you can't get them back.. generally. Their word vs yours, etc..
People can use their PayPay Buyer Protection if fees are involved and the seller is likely to lose more than the buyer by simply claiming an unauthorized transaction or doing a chargeback. They could get their money back and you won't get your item, so you have more to lose (but I don't know how this would work if they claim it was unauthorized.. "hey, someone unauthorized a friend and family payment to a very specific person. that is specific and suspicious."
I'm sure they can somewhat monitor who has access to the account. Plus the fact that someone is specifically being sent money seems also questionable.
If you sell through ebay, or I guess even if you do sell to someone on the internet, you could ship anything you could write down (product keys, bundle links, even steam gift copies)... which is like $2.45, the cheapest for tracking, and the cost of like $1 bubble mailer to claim you sent it. No idea how far that would get you though.
Here it pretty much seems like you are screwed unless you can trust the user anyway:
https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/useragreement-full#11
11.3 Eligibility Requirements.
To be eligible for PayPal Seller protection, you must meet all of the basic requirements listed below under (a) Basic Requirements. To be >covered for Item Not Received protection, you must meet both the Basic Requirements and the Item Not Received Additional >Requirements listed below under (b). To be covered for Unauthorized Transaction protection, you must meet both the Basic >Requirements and the Unauthorized Transactions Additional Requirements listed below under (c).Basic Requirements:
You must ship the item to the shipping address on the Transaction Details Page.
You must respond to PayPal's requests for documentation and other information in a timely manner.
The item must be a physical, tangible good that can be shipped.
Your primary residence, as listed in your Account, must be in the United States.11.4 Proof of Shipment, Proof of Delivery and Signature Confirmation Requirements.
"Proof of Shipment" is online or physical documentation from a shipping company that includes all of the following:The date the item is shipped.
The recipient’s address matches the shipping address provided on the Transaction Details Page.
The recipient’s address, showing at least the city & state, or city & country, or zip/postal code (or international equivalent).
"Proof of Delivery" for intangible or virtual items or services is documentation satisfactory to PayPal that the item or service was provided >to the buyer such as proof of download including the date of fulfillment.NOTE: Although Purchase Protection extends coverage to buyers for intangible items, Seller Protection does not apply to intangible >items. However, having proper Proof of Delivery can help a seller win a buyer’s Item Not Received Purchase Protection Claim.
And this part pretty much says you have no protection, butt 11.4 is like dangling a ray of hope saying you might be able to win a dispute, but good luck with that unless you're PayPal Digital Gifts.
11.5 Items/transactions not eligible for PayPal Seller protection. The following are examples of items/transactions not eligible for PayPal >Seller protection.
Intangible items, including Digital Goods, and services.
Comment has been collapsed.
Alright, basically it is a minefield, but one that can be maneuvered. First off, you have to learn about Paypal. You will want everyone to send friends/family, with them paying the fees. When you go to send money via Paypal, you will see the option. Make sure people are using this, as it significantly reduces the fees of the transaction. They will be given the option to pay the low fees themselves, you want them to do this as well, to make sure you get the money you asked for, in full. On that same page, you will also see a service called Paypal.me, you can use this to set up an exact transaction amount, too, though that is getting a little bit more complicated. You can read more, here.
So once you have your way of getting paid, down (Keep in mind a few countries don't offer friends/family and it gets more complicated, though it is rare to run into a problem), you then will have to decide who to take it from and how much. I generally recommend not getting too desperate. I personally only deal Paypal with people with 100+ clean reps and one transactions of $5 or more. I take other things for smaller transactions, like gems and keys. You can take other things and flip them for Paypal, if you really want.
Once you go through this process, then you will have more advanced things you can do, like force them to add notes to the transaction, which I generally recommend against. I saw it mentioned before, but I don't use it because notes fail to go through often and on top of them, Paypal auto scans them and will potentially red flag your account if the wrong words are used and you have a lot of transactions going on. For example, if they suspect it is related to gambling. I have seen it happen to a few traders. Notes are powerless, so you can get them to say whatever you want them to say and it won't do anything. People can still seek refunds.
You can also work in groups if you care less about profit. Group Buys was mentioned earlier. A lot of people split purchases, using Paypal, to only take what they want. No profit, but safer transactions, if you just want pieces.
Overall it is a lot harder to get into than say taking gems, TF2 Keys, CSGO Keys, Steam Wallet, etc... People can charge back on it and you won't be able to do anything, but leave negative feedback. That is why I say stick with good traders, only. No one wants to ruin really good rep.
Comment has been collapsed.
So much for the "I WON'T REFUND" in the notes. I just remember someone in the trade section having this as a requirement which sort of just makes me shake my head, but it's probably more as a "you will be forever flagged if you try to refund this". I can't quite tell if you mean notes are useless or not when claiming refunds.
The reason I don't believe it is because I just dealt with giving two refunds back where, I sort of believe, someone had access to two different PayPal accounts trying to buy an item from me and left the same note which made it really clear. Two different addresses with two different names.. yet the same note with only 5 days apart.
The only difference I believe is it will just ruin the rep of someone here. That's..... also what would happen even if they didn't add the note, though. Basically, I don't even see the purpose of adding a note if none other than to satisfy following someone's rule to ease their mind.
Next time I inevitably have to call PayPal for some reason, I am going to ask and see what type of response I get even if I doubt it will be one I can necessarily believe.
Comment has been collapsed.
They are useless, is what I was saying, so we agree. They do nothing for rep here, as you would just leave it either way. As for Paypal, a note can't stop someone from trying to get their money back. On top of that, as of right now, many people don't even have their notes go through. The note system is broken, for some.
Basically, the short version of what I was saying is that a note has no power over the sale, but can get you flagged if the wrong wording is put in them. One should never use notes, unless it is for their own benefit of keeping track of things. If it is for that, then they should be carefully worded. I have seen people have the wrong keywords trigger the Paypal auto scanning and end up with warnings on their account. Paypal is scared that people will use their system for illegal things like gambling, which is made worse when you suddenly have a lot of small transactions, from random people, showing up at once. I dealt with one trader that wouldn't even trade if you sent a note because they got him flagged and he was scared to use them. Paypal does check what you put in them, though it is clearly automated.
Comment has been collapsed.
Well it isn't really needed, unless you don't go first. You get all the info when you get the money on your end. If you don't like what you see, refund it back.
For the most part, people just drop a, you pay friends/family, pay all the fees, verified only type of deal. Most don't even say all that. At this point, most traders just know it. I usually say it to the people if I feel I need to, before the transaction happens.
What I'm saying is that you rarely have to worry about it, especially if you deal with only good traders.
Comment has been collapsed.
Isn't refunding back a last resort option? Since often people pay some fees and, as far as I know (am i mistaken?), pp won't give those fees back, in pratice they would end up losing money because of it.
Comment has been collapsed.
You can refund someone back immediately or if they give you the option, refuse the money. The fees on friends/family are tiny. Even if you didn't get them back, it wouldn't matter. Friends/Family is very, very cheap to use. For small transactions, it might be a couple of cents or even free if you are in the same country.
As I was saying, though, it is rare to run into any real problems if you stick with good traders. Having to refund someone back would be a last resort for someone that you just realized you can't trust, if they request it back to cancel a deal, or if something went wrong (Wrong total, sent as an Echeck, etc...).
Comment has been collapsed.
People might have other fees though, depending on country, if they have their bank account linked, etc. While for larger amount it might not matter, for anything cheap it might be enough to annoy the buyer, so I believe it shouldn't used without a good reason.
Comment has been collapsed.
I never said it should be used without a good reason. I clearly stated that if things were off, after the deal had started (Basically lies, unverified accounts, wrong total sent, etc), then that is an option that he would have as a seller, to protect himself.
People that use Paypal full time have a pretty solid understanding of how it works. I can't see mysterious fees coming into play or anything like that, for most people. I have been on both ends of a refund, for various reasons. For example, someone no longer being able to provide the item or if someone decided to back out and requested I just refund it back. No one is going to be losing money using Paypal. If they have additional fees somehow related to other mysterious things, then lets stick them in that same minority as the 1 in 1 billion user excuse that everyone seems to have on this site, every time a new feature is suggested. Oh no, this one person might do this and crash the whole system.
If he is going to learn Paypal, then he has to learn that he has that option, going both ways. Choosing when to apply the option is important, but like I said, it is rare to run into problems if you stick to good traders. Sure, he could sell a key that doesn't work and have to send the money back. He could find some sketchy Paypal account coming out the other end of money being sent or whatever. What is he supposed to do, never refund because of a fear that there might be a small fee for the other person, when there probably isn't even one?
He has to learn all the ins and outs if he is going to use it in trading. Otherwise, he is going to run into far more issues.
Comment has been collapsed.
I'm not saying he shouldn't know about this option. I'm just saying he should be fully informed about the potential consequences of using that option and that it should not be abused. If there is a reason to use it, of course he should. But after the payment has been made I think it's not a good time to change your mind because somebody made a better offer/you don't like this person's name/country/gender/etc, just because you can refund. People who have to pay fees don't usually bother to tell you about it, since it's their problem not yours, but they don't expect you to refund back either (provided they are honest). I don't think those fees are uncommon either (and I'm not sure why you call them mysterious). Again, this applies mainly to items which don't cost much, since the fees are still small.
Comment has been collapsed.
I said all along that it was an option if he had to use it. I'm not sure what the rest of this is about. Clearly he would say to the buyer that there is something wrong, ask for an explanation, then make a determination on the next move. Any seller would. I don't know why you expect he would abuse it or that anyone would. He has to learn how to lookout for bad things and mistakes, then know that he has an option.
I have to be honest. I'm not a fan of this it is possible, but not even the least bit likely game. The scenario game, as I like to think of it, really gets old after a while. I'm actually quite bored with this conversation. I told him what he needs to know, anything beyond this is just going to confuse him, over nothing. I can't help if there is someone out there that pays enormous fees when they use Paypal. All I can say is that most people don't and we all follow the same system. As someone that has traded a significant amount, as a seller and buyer, I can say that the system works almost every single time and if it ever doesn't, then you deal with it on the spot. You don't run scenarios on message boards about things that are unimportant to every day trading.
Comment has been collapsed.
This might help http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/forum/38-csgo-cash-trading/
Comment has been collapsed.
Thanks for the info, that's useful for me too. Was looking into possibly using opskins in the future and that was part of what I wanted know.
Thinking of selling all my cards soon. I have 7300+ and still farming. Was looking to buy CS:GO or TF2 items and then selling for cash. opskins looked safer than dealing with individual people and I was hoping to hear from people who had used the site and cashed out, plus wanting to hear about any fees.
My other main safe option was going to be Tremor Games. You can trade items in there for coins. While you can't cash to money, you can cash to Amazon vouchers which would have been ok for me if I had to but I'd rather have Paypal of course. Tremor's trade-in values are quite horrible to be blunt but at least it would have been safe.
Comment has been collapsed.
Glad I could help. I can assure you the site is legit, but if you have any question regarding fees/rules etc., it's better to check this subreddit + read the help section on their site. I rarely visit opskins, which means I'm not up-to-date with these things.
Comment has been collapsed.
First you have to mention that you are talking about TF2/CS:GO keys cuz some people are mistaking question for 'game keys'.
All you have to do is go to trading section amd post something like this:
https://www.steamgifts.com/trade/Sctkm/h-csgo-keys-w-205-paypal
Then choose to trade with someone with solid profile i.e high rep, old SG account, older Steam account, value of Steam account etc.
Also install this plugin/extention:
http://www.enhancedsteam.com/
Once installed you can see the SG link and steamrep link (https://steamrep.com/) right on their Steam profile. Click on the SG link to see if they really are who they claim to be.. Steamrep link will be red with 'SR scammer' if s/'he has been reported and proved to be scammer. Having clean steamrep doesn't necessarily mean he won't scam but if it's red then he is a confirmed scammer.
On other hand SG negative feedback doesn't really mean they are scammers as they aren't moderated. So you have to check what the negative feedback is about and who is giving it. But someone with more than a year old account, lots of positive feedback and no negative feedback makes it unlikely that they will scam.
There are many impersonators who will use someone's SG account rep of other people to scam. All it takes is having same profile picture and name to fool people new to trading. (That's how I got my negative rep). This plugin will also give you the real steam profile id link on the side.
Once you have confirmed that the guy you are dealing is legit and experienced, then just do what s/he says. Take screenshots/video of your conversations and transactions as backup and you are good. And lastly, log everything in a folder. Sometimes problems can arise from misunderstanding or mistakes instead of deliberate attempt to scam.
Comment has been collapsed.
I just noticed you have made a post 5 hours ago.
Take the example of the guy who offered you trade that you refused. Number of reps isn't the only thing that matters. He has a very solid Steam profile.
https://steamdb.info/calculator/76561197970378692/?cc=us
Not someone who is going to ruin his rep for mere 20 bucks.
Comment has been collapsed.
+1, reps are overrated. You can easily get hundreds of rep by doing low tier trades (cheap bundle keys, cards etc.) or trades without any risk (neither of you trade anything outside of the trade window) while you can't get a profile like that without a lot of money and time being invested into it.
Comment has been collapsed.
16,260 Comments - Last post 15 minutes ago by Zmerii
2 Comments - Last post 2 hours ago by bat0
7 Comments - Last post 3 hours ago by adam1224
64 Comments - Last post 9 hours ago by NIDJEL
229 Comments - Last post 9 hours ago by pizzahut
67 Comments - Last post 10 hours ago by Reidor
47 Comments - Last post 10 hours ago by Sinthoras
76 Comments - Last post 1 minute ago by HAKIMODO
1,568 Comments - Last post 44 minutes ago by lext
18 Comments - Last post 1 hour ago by canis39
377 Comments - Last post 1 hour ago by canis39
15 Comments - Last post 1 hour ago by cheeki7
40 Comments - Last post 1 hour ago by eguguwap
38 Comments - Last post 1 hour ago by FluffyKittenChan
I've never done this before, but seems awfully risky.
I've had too many keys sitting in my inventory for a while now though.
Can you guys run me through the safest way to do this? How you might do it? How you go about it if you're the one purchasing keys etc...
I would greatly appreciate advice from all of your experience instead of jumping in head first.
Comment has been collapsed.