Windows or Linux?
Day -1 (5/30/2024)
I've downloaded Nobara KDE NVidia ISO and RUFUS to make a bootable USB stick to install Nobara and first to preview it on my laptop.
On the 1st attempt RUFUS totally messed up my 30 GB USB stick. Quick formats didn't work, though they seemed to work, until I was trying to copy a larger file on it. Finally removing volumes from it, creating a 9 GB partition and waiting for an hour or so till it formatted, I've got it working and the boot stick created, though I'm still not sure, if the remaining 21 GB will also need to go through full format to be working correctly. Including reading to try to find solutions, it's been already close to 4 hours.
My 940M laptop GPU is supported by the distro, so it was time to make sure, that it's working OK and get the preview of the desktop. My first boot attempt has been blocked by MOK Management and it took me a short while to google it and then to disable Secure Boot in my BIOS.
Next time I've arrive at booting screen with 3 options: Boot Nobara, Check Installation Media and then boot Nobara, Troubleshooting. Checking and then installing has been a default, but I've decided to go with straight boot and got to a screen saying, that "this OS version is past its end-of-support date" (it's a newest distro offered for download on) and there the process hang without any additional message.
OK, here we go again, this time with checking. Checking didn't find any errors and this time quite smoothly I've passed the end-of-date message... only to get stuck 30 seconds later at some plymoth-quit.service message. Well, time for troubleshooting option, which says, that it uses limited graphics, then goes to the end-of-support message and hangs there as well, visibly not even getting to this plymoth-something.
So reading again, checking, if my download has been complete by hashing it, checking again my GPU compatibility, trying to launch Nobara again, reading some more, to finally find, that some folks did have a problem with plymoth delaying launch by up to 3 minutes. I've launched it once again, went for a quick shower and when I came back, Nobara was already finishing its boot up. Hurrah, hurrah, hurrah!
I've skipped the installation option, connected to my Wi-Fi and after only 6 hours I've been able to begin to play with KDE desktop, playing a bit with its configuration options... for just 5 minutes or so, because then it just hang on me. Hopefully though I have a fully functional bootable installation USB stick, which possibly tomorrow (or rather later today) will even correctly install Nobara on my new comp (if all parts come in, putting them together will go smoothly and Nobara is willing to be installed on it).
I guess, it went pretty good, because I didn't hear my neighbors yelling back a me...
Cheers :)
Day 0 (5/30/2024)
"You have rolled double one. One of your suppliers is using a shabby parcel delivery service. Move 3 days back"
... but they are very sorry, their apologies almost make me cry. Yes, the parcel is in their depot since yesterday morning, and yes, they have forgot to pass it to the courier. They will make sure to do this first thing Monday morning. Oh, on Saturday? Yes, they couriers will be in the area on Saturday, but no, they are very sorry, they can't do this, because the sender did not pay the extra fee for the Saturday delivery. Have a nice evening, Sir, we hope, that you will be 100% satisfied with our services.
Day 0, 2nd attempt (6/02/2024)
4pm. All parts are here. I've decided to pay $30 to my neighbor for assembling it (no tools, no spares for troubleshooting, etc.). Now waiting for the news, if the second hand graphic card work alright.
2am. Everything seems to work just fine. Only one fan on the graphic card is a bit noisy, but for the time being no rush to replace it. I brought it home like 7 hours ago... and didn't even have time to plug it in. I have to write a speech and prepare myself for a trip on weekend, Linux will have to wait, till I get everything ready. So day 1 will need to wait for a few days...
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Quite the ruffle but has a good ending.
I guess, it went pretty good, because I didn't hear my neighbors yelling back a me...
:)
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Unless I'm doing it wrong, looks like some characters are missing in that code
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Yeah it looks like the backslashes are being interpreted differently
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Thx, now it should work. Some characters entered have not been displayed.
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Aww, I thought that was part of the puzzle (trying to figure out which characters got misinterpreted and then add them to the link). If that were the intention, it would be a pretty original puzzle :D
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Same here, when I saw the yellow colored letters I tried to find patterns (to no avail) :D
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Actually 2 folks have solved it, analyzing the page source. They have passed the SGTools check, but didn't enter the GA, so anonymous kudos to them. And, yes, this would be a nice puzzle, but I didn't intent to put a hard puzzle here, just a slightly programming oriented bot check.
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When I'm at the pc, I usually play some game, then do something else (browse, email, some documents), then switch back to the game, and so on.
I installed Linux two or three times, years ago. At the time, most games didn't run on Linux, unless you really messed around with it, and I lacked (and still lack) the time and will to learn how to do stuff. So I realised that having to reboot the system every time I wanted to change activity, wasn't worth the effort. In addition to that, my parents sometimes use the pc for some email, printing or scanning documents, and so on. Now, my parents, despite having used a pc for the last 25-30 years of their work career, really don't know anything about computers. They don't even know how to install a program or open a zip file. If I removed the bookmark to the email login page, they'd be lost. They'd say the pc is broken if the boot screen appeared instead of the Windows desktop.
Therefore, if I changed the OS on the pc, then I'd have to fix their messes even more than now. XD
Anyway, I swore myself that I'll be using Linux if I'll ever have a laptop (which I have no use for right now).
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I'm the lucky one to be the only user of my comps. The only problem is, that having my Win 10 heavily customized, at times I have problems using other folks computers, cause that damn thing, that I'm looking for should be on the right side of the screen, as it's been since I've got Windows 2000, docked in the second folder of my taskbar... which obviously isn't there, lol.
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Hah! Customization is a double-edged sword, I guess.
I was talking about the pc we've always had home. Now I don't live with my parents anymore and I have my very own pc and nobody touches it. Still, for the use I make of it, I don't really see a point in switching to Linux.
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I'd like to share some though.
Currently, the only thing that keeps me using Windows is my habit, and my laziness.
Moving to Linux now would need some time and effort to re-partition the disk, likes sinking Windows' partition, move Linux /home to its own partition, etc.
That KVM is really cheap 💰.
During lockdown period, I had to invest a pair of multi-devices keyboard and mouse (Logitech), and they are more expensive.
My setup includes a work desktop (Think Centre), a personal laptop, a monitor, a mouse, and a keyboard.
With Windows 10, you can use the laptop's monitor as the desktop's secondary monitor, so the space it takes is limited.
Last time I checked, LibreOffice supports for macro is quite good now.
I stopped using MS Office since 2020, and I only use basic macro, so it may not reflect your usage.
If you have any problem, please report it to the LO issue tracker. It will help other member of the community.
I only play old games so I think they will run fine under Wine.
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You are very welcome to share you thoughts here.
I'm also too lazy to switch OS on a comp, that I have already working, especially that I heavily customize my OS and apps. Pruning (f.e. removing remote control stuff from Windows) and customizing the OS, and installing like 30 programs, that I always use (LibreOffice, Q-Dir, EditPad, IrfanView, VLC Player to mention just a few of my long time favorites), and customizing them as well (even the small stuff like additional dictionaries, making 3 instances of each browser, defining default save directories and custom file associations) on Windows usually takes me 3 to 5 days.
Thank for the tip as well. I didn't know, that with Windows 10 I can use the laptop's monitor as the desktop's secondary monitor. I will have to check it out.
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Some programs (Firefox, Thunderbird, LibreOffice, VLC,...) store their config in disk files (please see linked articles), and not the Windows' registry.
You can copy their config folder to another machine to save time, I think they work across platforms.
I'm not sure if you know about the add-on Multi-Account Containers for Firefox.
I use this add-on to access both my personal and work accounts (same service provider) at the same time.
I prefer this approach over creating multiple browser instances (profiles), since I only have one profile to manage; and browser's history, bookmark, and some add-ons are share between containers.
No need to copy and paste URLs between browser instance to bookmark them in the main instance.
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After a few years on Linux, I'm quite used to it and I wouldn't go back. In fact, we use Windows at work, and when I work from the office, it's actually a pain because nothing works the way I want it to. The fact I mostly work from home (yay remote work!) makes it all the more obvious. :D
And that's why I can say: yeah, it's a leap of faith, and yeah, not all games will work, and you'll need Windows if you really want to play them, but if you want to move, just persevere. You'll run into issues all the time at first, and some will be a major pain in the neck, but it gets easier after a while. You'll never stop having issues. Issues will always exist, because computers suck and all software is bad (even good software is bad). That's why you had issues even on the best versions of Windows, right? (Of course you had them, everyone has issues with software all the time, we just learn to figure them out.) Really, the final goal of moving to Linux is to go through less pain on Linux than on Windows, and I personally think I got there after a rather bumpy year or two. But on occasion my audio system will break on update or something, and then it's hell for a few days. :P
I must have MS Office (and Office 365 online doesn't suit me) to run some received documents with Excel macros
Hmm, I remember macros working on Calc. You may need to enable it somewhere or something. I vaguely remember that it wasn't super obvious or user-friendly, but it was definitely possible. It may be that Calc doesn't support something specific from the macros you need, though.
virtualizing Windows
Just remember that this takes a boatload of RAM because you're running two full systems plus the RAM required for the VM software itself. If you're still surviving with 8 GB, though, 16 per system should do for now and you can always upgrade again.
I also need to learn to synchronize the data
Your pain is my pain. :D
Also, bump for solved!
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...the final goal of moving to Linux is to go through less pain on Linux than on Windows...
Exactly. I often work at nights. I don't expect to never again wake my neighbors with my angry screams, I just hope, that I will do this less often.
Hmm, I remember macros working on Calc...
Sure, LibreOffice has fine macros of its own, but "since support for VBA is not complete, you may have to edit the VBA code and complete the missing support with LibreOffice Basic objects, statements and functions." So, if you want to migrate your own document, this may make sense, but getting outside documents created and having to use them and possibly send back with some changes it's a no-no for me.
...this takes a boatload of RAM...
Starting with 2x16GB for now just to test, if in the final system I will need more ;).
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I don't expect to never again wake my neighbors with my angry screams, I just hope, that I will do this less often.
Hahahaha, sounds like me alright. :D
"since support for VBA is not complete, you may have to edit the VBA code and complete the missing support with LibreOffice Basic objects, statements and functions."
Ah, yeah, that would definitely be a problem...
In that case, I guess you may want to look into whether MS Office runs well under Wine. If it does, that's one problem solved. I have no idea myself.
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From what I read, up to 2013 does work, later don't install without a VM. I should be OK with 2013, so that's a backup option, if VM Windows doesn't work well enough.
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I switched last summer. First I tried Manjaro. It looked good but would break constantly. Ran Arch for a bit. Again, quite flaky (for me at least). Then Pop OS which I quite liked (looking forward to seeing COSMIC) but it was a bit out-of-date at the time. What convinced me that it was time to give desktop Linux a try was how well Steam ran my Windows games. And any emulators I was running on Windows were also available on Linux.
Eventually I settled on debian (trixie first, then sid) and Gnome. That's what I've been running ever since. I don't need to boot into Windows for anything. There are a few apps I miss from Windows like foobar2000, 7zFM and Paint.NET, but not enough to want to run them via WINE.
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I decided to ditch Windows when Windows 11 rolled around and MS really, really, really wants you to sign in online with your official MS account now just to install the OS. This is where I draw the line, albeit rather arbitrarily (since we've had online activation with keys for a while now), the OS is the most basic part of my machine and I always need to be able to get it up and running without being tied to some online account. (Yes, I know that there are various tricks you can employ to bypass this, but given that these are continuously patched by MS it's really obvious that's not how they want you to use their product.) Since my old PC wouldn't even run W11 due to hardware restrictions (another great decision), I decided to go all the way and only install Linux on the new one.
10 years ago it would have been unthinkable for me to ditch Windows entirely; I've used Linux for work machines but since practically no games would run on it I've never used it as my daily driver on a gaming rig. But thanks to Valve and the Steam Deck and the massive efforts to make gaming on Linux a real thing now, I find that this is no longer a problem, and I've not yet found a game I can't run. I picked Manjaro as it's a friendlier version of Arch, which is the base distro used for the Steam Deck as well, which I figure gives the best odds of things just working. I kept around my old W10 installation on a separate disk as a talisman for a bit (just in case), but I've recently wiped it as I can't see any need to go back. For my job I do have a Windows laptop, but that's the property of my employer, so not my problem. I don't use that machine myself when I'm not at work.
As for running Windows apps, I would simply try Wine before going full virtualization, as it works for games after all. Best case, the installers just run and you have a working setup without the overhead of full machine virtualization and trying to pass through hardware, worst case it doesn't work but then at least you know. Second best option would be to just keep a Windows machine around for these things (with a KVM switch if you can't afford a separate screen). Least attractive to me would be mucking around with VMs or dual booting, as now you are still dealing with a Windows machine, but a much more finicky one than one with its own exclusive hardware. Dual booting works in a pinch if you can clearly separate "things you do on Linux" from "things you do on Windows" and it will hardly ever be necessary to reboot during the day, otherwise it's just a chore.
Synchronizing data is fairly easy: keep your data on the machine you primarily use it on, and set up an SMB share. These are painless to access from both Windows and Linux (in either direction). Alternatively, go cloud, get a free Dropbox account and use that plus EncFS to encrypt your files client-side (both Dropbox and EncFS are available for Linux and Windows); now you have synchronization and a backup as well.
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Why this thread?
This thread is just to share my experience as a somewhat competent and truly longtime Windows' user moving to Linux. When I have questions, I will keep asking them in Moving from Windows to Linux - Help thread.
Me
I've been using computers since the beginning of 1983, when I've got a $99 Times Sinclair 1000. I'm quite good at tinkering with my OS (that's how my Windows 10 looks right now). Being careful and following instructions I can put a desktop together or exchange a fan in a laptop, but I don't know almost anything about electronics and using laptops exclusively for the last 16 years I've lost touch with current components. After 8 lean years and barely making it through the last 2 of them, since 9 months ago I have finally grown up to qualify for retirement, which in my case means, that I'm once again quite well off.
Hardware
Even though my almost 10 y.o. HP Pavilion 15 (i5-6200U, 8GB, 940M) is still in surprisingly good shape, replacing or supplementing it was on the table already at least since the Black Friday.
The "or" is the problem though, as I still don't know, if in the next 5 years or so I will continue my pretty much "on the road" lifestyle or if I will settle down. Lately I've learned, that this will not become clear at least till the end of this year. Traveling I would need a pretty strong and expensive new laptop, mostly stationary I would gladly get just a new decent upgradable desktop and only later replace my current laptop.
Still stuck with just my laptop, I've decided to go for an interim cheap ($600) desktop, that I will put together myself and I will not be sorry to sell even in a few months. I went for the cheapest case and mainboard (H610M), I5-12400F, decent 2x16GB DDR4 3200 RAM, cheap 650W Gold PS (was cheaper, than Bronze), Lexar 1TB NM620 M2 SSD, factory refurbished Seagate ES.3 4TB 7200RPM HDD (just $60) and used ZOTAC GTX 1070 AMP 8GB ($100, at some point will need new fans). Last parts should arrive tomorrow. I will also get a cheap KVM switch, most likely this.
Why Linux
I've been using almost every Windows from 3.1 till 10, including Windows 2000 (which I preferred to the old good XP), except Vista and 8/8.1. I've been a very happy Windows 7 user. IMO it is Microsoft's best and most user friendly OS. If it was still up-to-date, I would happily stay with it. However. Windows 10 for me is the worst of all of those, that I've been using.
20 years ago I have experimented a bit with Linux and I've been occasionally using DVD bootable Knoppix for some tasks, but in general its incompatibility with gaming made it a no option for me. Well, Windows 10 and development of Wine has changed my perspective drastically, and if I was getting a new comp 7-8 years ago, I would already try to run it with Linux. With Steam getting into Proton and most of my gaming being done on Steam it's even more obvious now.
Why I will still need Windows
I run at times programs, that just don't have Linux replacements. F.e. preferring LibreOffice for everyday work, I must have MS Office (and Office 365 online doesn't suit me) to run some received documents with Excel macros. Such unexpected incompatibilities may pop-out any time, and then usually it's the time most inconvenient for troubleshooting the problem. I also want to be able to play games, which are incompatible with Linux.
I would however very much like to running those games and programs from within the Linux virtualizing Windows and being able to "alt-tab" between both systems, without too big cut in performance. According to some Internet sources, this may be entirely possible, but 1st lesson already learned, it would require CPU with integrated GPU (which I5-12400F doesn't have) and probably a mainboard able to deal with Single GPU Passthrough, where likely I will currently also fall short. Still, a lot of things to experiment with, even with this hardware.
My goals
It's a stopgap/learning setup, that I expect to sell long before 24 month component guaranties run off. Sure, I want to do some gaming on it (first of all play RDR2, that I have won quite a long time ago), but its main purpose is to learn all stuff, that I will need to know, when I finally can go all out. No matter if I land at a single strong laptop or decide to use a pretty weak laptop for professional use and get a second computer for gaming, I want all of them to run 95% on Linux, being fully capable to occasionally run Windows programs and games as well.
As a side note: I have never used 2 computers side-by-side, so I also need to learn to synchronize the data, because certainly, even having both computers turned on and accessible with the KVM switch, I will do some work stuff on my gaming machine, as well as I will use my laptop as a 2nd screen for some gaming aids/guides, while gaming.
So, let the journey begin with this running till June 29th small linux-friendly lvl 2 ROT-47 giveaway:
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