Thank you for posting this Cg! :3
A lot of new functionally for those that trade here. ^^
Will there be dedicated support members over on the ST site or will the support members be the same members for ST and SG?
Comment has been collapsed.
uuh.
Hourly updates? Are you sure you aren't biting too much?
Comment has been collapsed.
if it is an automated process I dont see the problem, execpt the serverload processing all that data...
Comment has been collapsed.
Sounds like some good and interesting improvements/changes.
However, with separate databases, this will mean usernames on SteamTrades may differ from those on SteamGifts, and suspensions on one site do not affect usage on the other.
In regards to this, does that mean that users who got previously banned for gibs and not for trades will be back from the "dead" for trades?
Comment has been collapsed.
Certain suspensions are being copied over, such as those for advertising, referral links, multiple accounts, and more. Giveaway related suspensions will not be copied.
Comment has been collapsed.
Users with previous trades or reputation have been automatically moved to our new site
I think my rep are safe now , Thank you CG
Comment has been collapsed.
Nice, thanks for sharing! I've just recently got into trading and was wondering why trades were down! Lol.
Happy to see some improvements coming!
Comment has been collapsed.
Voting can be scammed by those +rep groups
Edit: On the bright side I wonder if trades were server migrated to have less impact here?
Comment has been collapsed.
On the bright side I wonder if trades were server migrated to have less impact here?
That's definitely one benefit.
Comment has been collapsed.
I mean only created a second site, but not sure if also CG acquired a second server only for this purpose.
Comment has been collapsed.
well.. yeah it could go either way.. the database is clearly getting split, but that doesn't necessarily mean the load will be split between different servers.. i sure hope it is though.
Comment has been collapsed.
Voting can't be scammed, you are given a page with random reps to vote on.
Comment has been collapsed.
"User Reputation for All Steam Users"
so "all" steam user not steamgifts/steamtrade?
i think this is bad, since this can be abuse to gain more +rep by fake steam accounts
no different with +rep on steam profile
hope i misinterpret
Comment has been collapsed.
I guess non-steamgifts user can only get a review, but can't leave a review to a second account.
Or at least I hope so :\
Comment has been collapsed.
So I scam a non-SG user, quickly leave a report of him trying to scam me, and he cannot do anything against it, and I can repeat it with any amount of people on Steam who haven't registered on this site yet but want to start up trading. And since newbies never check SteamRep, even if I get busted there, I can continue doing it as long as no SG user ever finds out.
Comment has been collapsed.
Yes.
the rep system would be useless if I can create a lot of sg-accounts
Comment has been collapsed.
I think the removal of negative reviews should still come down to a mod.
If it's purely up to getting X number of votes, scammers will game the system with multiple accounts thus removing possible legit negative feedback.
Maybe have it go to a mod queue but only after reaching a certain number of votes? That way the final decision is still made by a human :)
Other than that, right on! Can't wait to see it when it goes live!
Comment has been collapsed.
"When viewing the voting page, you'll notice the username of the reviewer remains anonymous to prevent bias."
Comment has been collapsed.
Yeh, who cares? The person who leaves the neg feedback is anon, that doesn't stop a bunch of fake votes for "this is invalid feedback" to get it removed.
Let's say I scam you, you leave me neg rep. I get all my friends to downvote your feedback, do you think it matters that they can't see your username?
Comment has been collapsed.
agree.. maybe a limitation like "only those that have +'xyz' amount of rep can vote, and it requires 'zyx' amount of voters"
Comment has been collapsed.
Pretty sure, you got that wrong ... you can rate them and they can rate you - no one rating is "anonymous".
The voting process however is anonymous/nameless. ´Meaning just the reason for negative feedback is being accessed
not the user himself (aka his steam profile?) ... which makes kinda weird/hard to access the situation to begin with "sorta" ...
Comment has been collapsed.
There are a few variables in place to help prevent vote manipulation. For example, there's a good chance none of your friends will even have the option to vote on the particular review you want removed.
Comment has been collapsed.
What about members of the same group? There is at least one (or two, if the old Rep4Rep wasn't shut down) group out there who specialise on rep4rep setups.
Or the other side: since trading has to be done through Steam chat, all trade partners have to be on each others' friend list. Meaning the people who could vouch for a trader's legitimacy couldn't vote against a false claim, only total strangers could.
Comment has been collapsed.
Trade Offers do not require a user to be on your friend list.
Comment has been collapsed.
And how many of the trades here are actual inventory item for inventory item ones? And how would traders agree upon prices and format? Steam chat is used for trades, what was here was more like an agreement on discussing the details. But trades were always done through chat. Steam trades are always done through chat. Even at barter, which is a site that sets up the actual trades, advices and tells you to finish the thing in chat. SteamRep asks for chat logs when you go there with a scam claim. You simply cannot do even the simplest of Steam trades without adding the other to your friend list and speak with them in chat. And if actual money or keys are involved, this goes to even more certainty.
Comment has been collapsed.
Ok. Good luck to them finding that specific negative feedback.
Comment has been collapsed.
The exact method of removal will be determined in the coming weeks as we better analyze user votes.
I think that's the important part. By looking at how the voting is handled by the community it'll be easier to determine what constitute a valid vote.
Comment has been collapsed.
It is still just asking the users to police themselves, just now you ask the users to police themselves on how they police themselves. To use an analogue, it is like if at the American election you send your electors from a state to cast the votes, then you ask every other elector from all other states to vote on if they accept the vote of the electors.
Comment has been collapsed.
hmm. okay. all, sounds pretty good to me. (i think.. kinda a lil worried about community voting abuse though)
Comment has been collapsed.
+1. I'm afraid that people with many friends can get valid negative rep removed.
Comment has been collapsed.
yeah, that's my thought too.. maybe/possibly a limitation like i suggested above might help prevent that to a degree. or it may just cause groups of people to form and rep each other in preparation to battle it.. i would hope the former though.
possibly= "only those that have +'xyz' amount of rep can vote, and it requires 'zyx' amount of voters"
Comment has been collapsed.
nice changes! I just hope some users don't ruin that.
Comment has been collapsed.
Of course they will, they always do. :P
As we say in software programming: make your application idiot-proof, and they will build a better idiot.
Same goes for exploits. There will always be people looking for ways to exploit the system. The important thing is to be proactive and to fix the loopholes as they are discovered.
Comment has been collapsed.
Well our rep is saved, good! Cant wait 20 hours :D want to see new site.
I hope trade threads are saved too.. If i imagine making it agin i getting heart attack xD
Comment has been collapsed.
I like that we're getting a better rep system (especially commenting on negative rep) but I was hoping the trade system would improve as the current system is pretty much useless.
Comment has been collapsed.
I was hoping the trade system would improve as the current system is pretty much useless.
cg said:
However, like most users, I'd like to see improvements in that area in the near future.
This is just a first step. Be patient. Development of this kind has to go in stages.
Comment has been collapsed.
I agree. It's a nice improvement, but the core of the trade section is quite useless. Even barter.vg, which is so much more useful in this regard, has significant shortcomings (lack of automatic matching being the most obvious to me). I guess spare keys were meant to be given away rather than traded ;-)
Comment has been collapsed.
What do you mean with "lack of automatic matching"? I mean, from my understanding / definition I'd say it does exist on Barter. Or do you mean for specific games only rather than getting matches for entire lists? The creator of Barter made a lot of changes and was really engaged until the point when he suddenly disappeared. I think we would have a perfect trading system by now if he was still there ;/
Comment has been collapsed.
Comment has been collapsed.
Every negative review on our site will go through the voting process, and the review will be automatically removed if decided on by the community.
So, since all Steam accounts can now be on the new-old site, scammer hires a botnet, downvotes all negative reviews against him, and comes out squeaky clean?
Or newbie trader actually gets a duplicate key or a retraded item that is revoked, downvotes popular high-rep trader, all his friends downvote the "attack" against him, and newbie gets nothing and no way to express bad trade opinion?
Comment has been collapsed.
this is a lot of peoples fear i can tell already. i really hope there are some kind of unmentioned requirements to vote at the very minimum, but even that i fear can and would get abused.
Comment has been collapsed.
This could be done like you say, I hope Cg made allowance for these kind of situations to avoid abuse.
Edit: https://www.steamgifts.com/discussion/yWGlf/steamtrades#Zw7pniV
Comment has been collapsed.
yep - pass the popcorn for that one - given the recent repping steam groups that have featured here :)
Comment has been collapsed.
You can leave a feedback to any Steam account, but that doesn't mean that they can use the website (as far as I know)
Comment has been collapsed.
That is another funny thing. if registration will still have a restriction on it, then anyone can just blindly accuse an account of an actual person with anything, and if they don't meet the requirements, they will be marked as a scammer without any chance for them to defend themselves.
But if anyone can register freely, then expect a BotNet galore.
Look, I can appreciate the effort put into revamping the trades section, but this thing looks like how my government does things: have some idea on how a system could be possibly improved, then immediately carry it out before doing a lengthy consultation on the actual participants and users of said system on what changes need to be carried out and exactly how. I understand that this is cg's site, but doing a platform for people to do charity by his rules and a platform to do business with goods outside his jurisdiction are two fundamentally different things.
Comment has been collapsed.
Won't the voting system for negative reviews just allow groups of bad actors to whitewash their reputations?
Comment has been collapsed.
exactly what i was thinking, what's will prevent that scamers get several accounts or friends to wash their name?
Comment has been collapsed.
I re-read this (well my eng is bad) but i think this voting system on negatives would be xploited. I guess users who never got negative rep now get some xD
Comment has been collapsed.
Daaaamnnn, cg is on fire! These changes will really help against impersonation and fake negative feedback. Will there be different support members and a FAQ for this new trading site? :D Thanks for all these helpful changes. ^_^
Comment has been collapsed.
Hi SG, we're rolling out some updates to our trade section in the next 24 hours. These changes are mostly geared towards the separation of trades to SteamTrades.com, and improving on the feedback system. No major changes to the core of the trading system are happening in this particular update and the site will still maintain the familiar discussion based format. However, like most users, I'd like to see improvements in that area in the near future. Below is the upcoming announcement to be listed on SteamTrades.com, highlighting some of the more noteworthy changes.
User Reputation for All Steam Users
To help SteamTrades continue to grow as a leader in Steam user reputation, our site now allows reputation to be written for every individual with a Steam account. To leave a review for a user, simply visit our homepage and search for a Steam user using their Steam ID, Steam vanity name, or Steam profile URL. Once forwarded to their SteamTrades profile, you'll see an input box at the bottom of their profile allowing you to leave a review regarding your trading experience together.
Replies to Negative Reviews
If a user has left a negative review on your profile, SteamTrades now allows you to write a public reply to their review. This way you can better inform users visiting your profile about why that review exists, and at the same time it provides you with an opportunity to share additional details the user might have excluded from their review. Below a negative review on your profile you'll see a Reply button, which you can click to add your reply. Please note, replies are only available for negative reviews.
Negative Review Voting
To help improve the quality of negative reviews and to help remove negative reviews that do not meet our standards, we added a voting page, where users can vote on negative reviews from others in the community. Using the guidelines listed, users can vote on whether a negative review should be allowed, or whether it should be removed from our site. Reviews will be automatically removed if decided on by the community.
User Profiles and Safety Check
User profiles now contain a safety check. This data is updated hourly, and helps you to be aware of any Steam infractions a user may have against their account (such as VAC or game bans). As well, user profiles show when a user registered on Steam, when they were last logged into Steam, their Steam level, and their game count (if their Steam account is public). Combined with our user reviews, this data can help you better determine a user's overall reputation before trading.
Design and Interface
Our entire site has been redesigned and recoded with a wide variety of improvements. The changes allows for quicker replies, and overall faster load times. Our database is now separate from our sister site, SteamGifts. Users with previous trades or reputation have been automatically moved to our new site. However, with separate databases, this will mean usernames on SteamTrades may differ from those on SteamGifts, and suspensions on one site do not affect usage on the other. For that reason, profiles on SteamTrades link to Steam IDs, rather than usernames to help avoid confusion.
Comment has been collapsed.