Underwhelming or not?
B-but the theories about bran being the NK and all those other theories... they ded now
I liked them.
But the thing that is the most infuriating is.... what where the NK intentions, for real? His origin? We only have a few info and they are all given by bran, the 3eyed raven "vessel" who happen to be (in the books) a much more complex character https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1oEqnDAbCfE
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Isn't benjen supposedly a wight that was "half-transformed" and maintained in that state by the children of the forest? Given the fact that the NK and the childrens are all dead, he is toast. We will never know.
I should read the books when they are done. Maybe.
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At first i thought , alot pople will die , but then i remembered what happens to the dead... :3
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Can you resume shortly what was different in the books? He died in them??
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He didn't, actually. The last we know of Theon in the books is in one of the preview chapters from The Winds of Winter, where Asha does suggest to Stannis that beheading would be a more fitting death to him, if he will not ransom him, but if it happens or not (I'm guessing 'not') will likely remain a mystery until the book actually comes out, if that ever happens.
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One interesting difference in the books is that his bonding with Sansa just doesn't happen, as Ramsay Snow marries an impostor (Jeyne Poole) passing for Arya Stark, so that part of his redemptive arc can't happen.
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Too few episodes left, far too many questions which will remain unanswered.
Also, dagger beats dragon-fire. The real MVP.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0qdZ8A3GLE
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Don't get your hopes high, it's look like a leak from some months ago is true and what's to come is... well, you'll see if you aren't bothered by spoilers: https://old.reddit.com/r/freefolk/comments/a4ea1k/spoilers_i_know/
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Thank you for sharing, I don't mind it at all at this point.
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Here is more, it might be totally true: https://www.reddit.com/r/freefolk/comments/84djfa/new_s8_set_leak/
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The only good aspect from the entire episode was this song.
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For the ending, yes... i expected such a mind blown moment but... the big evil man who we know almost nothing about died like a bitch, somehow being surrounded by thousands of wights and his dozen of white walkers generals and none saw arya coming
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Yes, I cannot find arguments to contradict your statement. No amount of potential plot twists in the last three episodes, can undo the wasted potential represented by the cartoonish demise of a mute villain teased since the start of the show.
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Was pretty stupid to tease a Jon Snow vs. NK fight only to kill the NK the way they did.
Other than that, was an amazing episode.
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It was made so that the audience would forget about Arya.
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I thought it was brilliant. It distracted from what really happened later. And it further showed how hopeless the situation was (when Jon was so close and ran, but still couldn't get to him).
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Spoilers.. duh..
0) Regisseur: - "Its dark, snowing and smoky... hey.. lets add motionblur... omegalul"
1) Sending the Dothraki in was absolutely useless.. no reason at all...
2) 3 People with their back to the wall can fend of hordes of undead... rest.. not so much..
3) Arya can sneak by a shitload of undead... and kills him with a 0815-move.. "ok"..
4) Backstory for the NK? nope.. just dead
5) Bran: "I m high right now, brb lol" <- absolutely useless "vision" aka "i m on drugs right now" part..
6) Hey.. undead are coming.. lets go to a crpyt... what could possible go wrong... -> ah never mind, absolutely nothing happened here.. except.. maybe tyrion has a chance to shag his wife one more time..
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Nah, the Dothraki totally played their role: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nrh5YOQHvFw
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Spot on.
Cavalry's used for support and flanking, not a direct charge right at the start of a battle. They're the "hammer" for the "anvil" which is the infantry. That's a basic tactic since ancient times.
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ever heard of the charge of the light brigade?
" Not though the soldier knew
Someone had blundered."
" Boldly they rode and well,
Into the jaws of Death,
Into the mouth of hell
Rode the six hundred."
" When can their glory fade?
O the wild charge they made!
All the world wondered.
Honour the charge they made!"
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Yeah, one suicidal charge won't counter MILLENNIA of tried and tested cavalry tactics. But the Dothraki did just that. An obvious mistake with deadly consequences.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charge_of_the_Light_Brigade
"The Light Brigade reached the battery under withering direct fire and scattered some of the gunners, but they were forced to retreat immediately, and the assault ended with very high British casualties and no decisive gains." After seeing GoT S8E3 this should sound familiar.
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I hoped for proper tactics and Dragon "warging".
Sadly disappointed, effectively everyone without plot armor died, so no idea where they'll get an army for heading south.
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that's the point of the next episode. exposition and preparation for the next big battle.
Then episdoe 5 will be the big battle, and episode 6 will be wrap-up
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I expect that more survivors will magically have survived.
It felt like a warcraft 3 fight with heroes being the only ones left.
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Thought the same, maybe some oil, Tyrion doing some stuff planning, and who would believe the damn cripts are safe after they saw the NK reviving the death.
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Maybe Arya was wearing a Wights....face.
That's what I would have written when that skinny kid looked under the table for her. Slice! And join the NK's posse that was going for the tree :)
And where's all them babies at? Looks like a "To be continued....never" bit there.
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Everything was leading up to this point. Littlefinger giving Bran the, I guess, Lightbringer, the dagger made out of Valyrian steel. Bran giving it to Arya. Arya training with Brienne, and, not to freaking forget she trained for a full season before, shaping out to be an assassin.
Also, she sneaked past everyone, but in the last moments, everyone knew she was there and they informed the Night King about this, but as we previously saw, when Theon ran to his death, no one did anything, because the Night King can handle it, again, as we saw. Now, fast forward a little bit and there's this tiny child-like girl running at him. Why would anyone do anything about her except Night King? He couldn't have known she's a killer, so he let her slide, grabbed her throat and she did a slight-of-hand and undid what the Children of the Forest did with the dragonglass since only Valyrian steel could undo that.
So yeah, there's that.
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It was cool in a way, but damn... that was abrupt, we know nothing about the NK about so much time.
3 big episodes left, against cersei or it seems. No fucking way to know what will happen (except for the leaks i posted but...)
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They should have made it so she used Theon as a distraction, not just jump down at the end.
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That was my thinking as well. Ever since he smirked at Jon the NK was way overconfident and was basically monologuing. He didn't expect a puny girl could do that.
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Well, this was definitely the worst battle episode. The best way I can describe it is "Pussies direct a battle"
Too bad they never really gave us wideshots to see the actual battle. Instead we saw a shitload of jumpcuts to emulate the frantic nature of the battle, which worked at first. But they themselves slowed everything down right when Arya's library scene started. It just went downhill from there.
The scenes were so fucking disjointed, it was painful to watch. Jon's surrounded by wights... literally they need to take one step and stab him to death. Cut away... cut back, Jon has no one behind him and he's killed all of them. These cheap moments happened so often that it felt like an episode of The Walking Dead. Every major death was a minor character. Theon's arc was done, Lyanna is as minor as it gets (and her death could've actually been brutal... instead it was a bad green screen effect and it was turned into a Hollywood death), Jorah's arc was long done and it'd have been weird if he survived, Beric (firesword boi) is minor, Edd was an obvious death (the fucking stupid scene with them looking at each other before dying... fuck, too cliché), Viserion had an actually good death. Melisandre's death was... nonsensical, i'd say. She decided to just die.
Benioff and Weiss are too pussy to actually run the show. They don't want real deaths because of backlash or personal interests. There's a reason why suddenly no one died when they started writing for the show.
They created an enemy that was too good. They were too strong. Their numbers were too large, their abilities were too strong. So they got nerfed a lot. Which is weird since they showed them at their real power with the Dothraki charge. They charged in and they bit the bullet in moments. It made sense. The wights feel no pain, they have a collective consciousness and they're agile and strong as fuck. In reality, Arya shouldn't have even made it near the center of the ring and the Night King shouldn't have died. They created this problem themselves. The battle was physically unwinnable and they had to basically just lie and make shit up to pretend that they pulled it off. Literally all of them should've died. No question about that. No matter what you think of your character, they wouldn't have made it out.
And you can see how it was so "Hollywoodized" with scenes where the main characters were all badasses with only one enemy really attacking them at a time, with them holding out alone with the actual army being dead for a long time.
If this were some random Hollywood movie, this'd be top notch. But this is Game of Thrones and the bar's been set high. This was not good. This was good when compared to everything else, but that is normal for GoT. On standards of Game of Thrones, this was just bad writing and a fear of committing to what they set up.
Edit: It also was tactically nonsensical.
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nice to read your opinion, agreed with most of it but it was pleasant to watch anyway.
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I agree with most of it. Specially about the slowdown around half the episode. Also, I'd "like" they used Ned vs Dane replay with Jon and NK, then Arya stabbing him would make much more sense and Jon would get to finish him... I know everyone is now changing story to "yeah the throne is the main quest" but it was never for Jon. It was for Cersei and Dany and maybe a few others... Jon was always about finding himself and his place in the family/north/world...
Anyway, yeah, scenes where dothraki dissapear in the night - scary. Scene when wall of death pushes through unsullied... what was supposed to happen.
Next scene when unsullied are still standing... and the same wall becomes a few struggling deathwalkers through the castle, while jaimie fights them off with his bad hand while pressed against the wall... more sad than funny.
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Yeah, definitely feels like they made the first third of the episode with a couple of other scenes (Like with The Hound and Melisandre or Jon surrounded, or Dany getting surrounded) and then thought "Oh fuck... they can't beat that army... okay... can't throw out the footage, so we'll have to wing it!".
The army of seemingly 50,000 white walkers or so turned into an army of around 1500-2500.
Arya now just warps through bone and flesh into a literal circle of wights. Jon kills 80 wights who have surrounded him. Dany falls off a dragon into a sea of wights only for them to disappear the next moment. There was killer fog and weather manipulation even... nothing was seen later. It's just a mish-mash of rushing production and covering up mistakes.
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"like an episode of The Walking Dead"
That's what GoT is since like season 4. Once the showrunners ran out of books to adapt actually good ideas from,all GoT became was action shlock with fan service for the dumb masses.
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These cheap moments happened so often that it felt like an episode of The Walking Dead.
Jon cutting through a literal army of the dead (while offscreen) is some Glenn-level plot armour.
My opinion in a nutshell: episode looked great, but was a pain logically and dramatically.
Literally everything is at stake at the final moments, so obviously only Deus Arya Ex Machina helps. Bran did fuckall. Maybe I was just thinking a bit too much about Inifnity War, but I would have expected to fight hte Night King by either two people grabbing him so someone can get a clear cut/stab, or Bran trying to mentally distract him. Something like organized teamwork, instead of individual heroes surviving because main actor aura.
( I loved Arya's hide and seek scene, some awesome scenes and director work, though got a bit too long, and that was the only part anywhere using their head)
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The thing is that the conclusion was impossible and they wrote themselves into a corner every time.
The wights are literally 4-5 steps away from the archers in the circle protecting Bran and the archer has an arrow drawn. Cut. Now, in reality, this is the circle breached right there already. Yet in reality, they hold out far longer.
The wights are literally in mixed in the infantry ranks outside the walls and they keep piling in. Somehow, a clear retreat happens and the only ones getting to the walls are humans.
Multiple supporting characters get overrun, cut away and suddenly they get saved.
The army is around 50k bodies at least for the wights. Once they reach inside the walls, it's 2000 at best.
That Jon nonsense, of course.
Dany falls into the wights and for some reason no one noticed her and she got away unscathed.
Bran's surrounded by a solid circle wall of wights standing. Cut away. Cut back in, Arya somehow morphs through physical mass.
Samwell's literally on the ground getting stabbed by multiple wights when Jon runs past. Nah, he's alright somehow.
The entire army is dead, yet the supporting characters are all still fighting and they're literally alone against hundreds, in their own corners just slashing away. Wights obviously don't run at them. They go at them one at a time now.
The Hound and Melisandre wait for the door to be knocked down. That doesn't even happen with this specific door for some reason.
There were more moments like that. Create a tense situation and have them be rescued off-screen since they made an impossible situation. Physically and narratively.
Bran did fuckall.
In truth, I was thinking the same thing, but I also think it makes so much sense. The dude sees the future, essentially. Sure, not totally, but he sees glimpses of it. Odds are he just saw it coming and made the cold (pun intended) and calculated move of sacrificing people. When Arya came, he wasn't surprised. He was more like prepared for that. I'm guessing that's the case at least.
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You're right about Bran. It's just frustrating how basically he is waiting for the plot armour to happen. Would have worked a lot better with proper fights and with a script with proper tension. (Dr Strange essentially had the same role role in Infinity War, when it comes for knowing a lot more than others. And played out a lot better because the writing)
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Let's be fair, in Infinity War literally everyone had massive amounts of plot armour. A missile hits 3 normal human beings and 2 superheroes in the face and all survive. The explosion even knocks them underground to the sewer level, buried by rubble. It's basically them all surviving a .50cal to the face. As to Doctor Strange, he played a more active role, but he also wasn't a depressed cripple boy who lacked any superpowers and who was in a more gritty world. Strange sees the entire future. Bran sees glimpses. Strange knows exactly what he's doing and what he can and should do. Bran sees some bits and pieces and basically figures it out from there. Plus, let's be fair, the GoT universe should technically be more punishing. Doctor Strange could probably kill Thanos twice in a row if the plot needed it and nothing would change. The tones are extremely different. Happy-go-lucky with no real consequences vs. dark and oppressive which should technically have harsh consequences. The whole movies was just a load of contrivances, in my opinion at least. Some things were better done, but some things were also worse.
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Agreed on all of that. The very differently toned similarities only came to my mind because I've seen Endgame on Friday, and S8E3 on Saturday evening / Sunday morning ( I was too seepy to watch it in one go :D )
. And yes, the missiles were made out of rubber or something. At that moment it felt stupid but then the action made me forget about it, so they succeeded!
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Was expecting way more deaths at least, guess they are scared of backlash now...
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Don't worry, they still have a full army to beat with what's left of them (so about 20 dudes and maybe hot pie)
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I get where you are coming from, but this was their major chance to bid farewell to many characters, i doubt they'll kill many in last 3 episodes, but a man can hope.
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If you don't mind spoilers i posted just above a link where a member of the family of a HBO employee shared, 4 months ago, the details about Lyanna mormont death, the nk death... If the man is right (it seem it is), there will be more death and something big ahead
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I would rather not spoil myself, thanks for heads up tho, gonna try and enjoy last 3 weeks as it was intended.
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i mean, since HBO has pushed the accelerator pedal for this show since 3 seasons ago, i think this was much part of the course of TV writing it has become synonymous with.
i dont hate it, i see the books and the show as separate, so i tough it was alright, wish Arya would sneaky her way to the NK with her faceless powers, rather than Assassins Creed him, but apart from that it was alright.
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Haha, i was being too lazy to read to books but how the NK ended sealed the deal for me. Once they are all released, i will read them all in one go
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Yeah, I am really disappointed for the points that were stated above. Starting with the logical flaws like burning your entire cavalry by having them storm into pitchblack darkness and then have your artillery fire at the very same position just for shits and giggles and going on to the cut that made it hard to watch and follow the story, to the missing concept of army size - I mean really they could have just covered the entire castle in undead and have them suffocate because of their army size, but conveniently the undead stopped at the hall just to enter one by one! And this may be officially the first episode where I actually wanted people to die, just because of statistics. 10k soldiers die, 20k undead die but magically our heroes survive to save the day in one heroic save after another. (Except your plot armor is gone - Oh yeah Beric we all knew this would happen...) Even the end felt really off, because Lyanna Mormont seconds ago killed Zombie-Wun-Wun in a similar manner. It was just too much.....
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Not to mention they put the trebs in front of everything, firing once or maybe just twice. wOrTh iT
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Even earlier, keeping their catapults ready to move (i.e. on wheels) would´ve killed their firing soultion after 1st shot and nothing else. Not to mention that you should never ever count your last line of defence on being ignited by two of your rarest assets. Ever heard of tar?
That, plus most of the mentioned gripes here, and my general dislike for scenes that portray Darth Vader in the dark render this episode quite underwhelming for my taste. I just hope they bring zombi-mountain to a cunclusion, i´ve been waiting 2 seasons for that guy to heal only to never hear from him again :E
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I liked it but expected more, I'm fine with Arya killing NK but not having single 1on1 sword fight with Jon vs NK or at least one of his generals during whole episode felt disappointing, i understand that all complaints about "prince who was prmomised" and "why did jon resurect" can be argued and there are very good explanations for it, I get it, still just wanted to see Jon having more important role in the fight as he was the one who prepared everything, everything about NK was building up to Jon, ofc Arya too now when you rewatch episodes so that why I am fine with her killing NK, altho I didn't like that it was very fast death, no fight, generals being useless (they didn't fight anyone...) like "Bran" (who is maybe not useless and maybe he did set this all up but then again everyone can complain about him being useless if show didn't give us any clue to him setting things up, seeing future). Also didn't like battle in the open, lots of snow, DARK episode again, many cuts, it was hard to see anything in fight out of winterfell, once it went into winterfell it was better.
So kinda let down on end because expectations and build up about Jon who was first to see NK, fight him, NK looking down at Jon at Hardhome like he sees something in him, "prince/princess that was promised" "azor ahai" I would be more happy, all they had to do in my opinion is give us 1 fight with Jon, he could even lose, maybe NK doesn't kill him but beats him, or someone said that when Jon yelled at Dragon, that if you rewatch that scene and listen carfully, you will hear that he YELLED GOOO GO GOOOO, so theory is that he was ready to die to distract dragon so Arya can sneak and on end kill NK, that would be in his character and would make whole episode feel better to me, but since they didnd't show or give any hint that Jon wants to distract Dragon, it can be argued that he accepted Death there...Also since NK was immune to Dragon fire, and Jon is part Stark, represnts both Fire and Ice, resorected by Lord of Light, I hoped that Dragon will blast him but Jon will not be hurt, maybe noone would have to even see this, but instead let Jon alone think about that moment in next episodes, wondering why he was immune to blue fire, why NK didn't want to fight him...etc
Lastly what about weird signs that NK was leaving for humans to see, like what, that is his sigil? That's it, no deaper meaning...
So on end, my disappointment comes from missed potential of this episode, that whole build up to this, It is not bad just feels it could be much more, emotions are now high and I maybe missed more points about this and why I feel this way but I think you should be able to get my point even if you were completly satisfied with episode.
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A pretty good episode, considering the show was basically turned into a comedy and I laughed a lot.
Last week's "Game of Thrones Holiday Special" set the bar pretty high for nonsense, but they still managed a few hilarious moments. My favorites were probably Mr Freeze's dragon coming out of the clouds to breathe ice at Daenerys' dragon's butt for no apparent reason, and Theon's bow having a higher rate of fire than mine in Monster Hunter, but it's hard to ignore Arya's "let's play Metal Gear for 10 minutes between 50 battle scenes" and "backstab crits were pretty effective in Baldur's Gate so they're probably fine in any medieval setting".
Weirdly enough I found the Sansa / Tyrion scene in the crypt where she pulled out a dagger for suicide kinda sweet, but since they ran away 2 seconds later and they survived anyway, it was pretty moot :/
I expected a higher bodycount though. Something like Baelor's Sept 2.0 with blue fire instead of green. And I'm having more and more trouble not to go berserk whenever Jon calls Daenerys "Dany".
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"After episode 2: How will they pack the conclusion to the show into 4 episodes?
After episode 3: How will they stretch the conclusion to the show into 3 episodes?"
Great battle scenes. Awful writing. So many flaws and stupid scenes. 8 seasons hearing that "Winter is coming", for it to finish in about an 1h. Bravo.
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The only question I have is: Where are the goddamn dog-sized spiders I was promised in season 1?
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Not one of my favorite episodes. I enjoy 98% of what I see on GoT, but this episode was more like 50-50. Most or all of these were mentioned before, but the things that annoyed me were:
- The tactics of starting the battle by sending the cavalry-- fire swords or not-- into the darkness. This after apparently having not done much recon of the situation.
- Daenerys lack of strong reaction to seeing her loyal soldiers get slaughtered.
- Everybody just standing there and watching the undead stand by the fire moat outside the castle instead of, you know, sending in a dragon to torch them since they were in a nice long line. Or at least firing arrows! They just waited until they did the obvious maneuver of forming a bridge of bodies.
- Absolutely no plan to handle the eventuality of the undead clamoring up the wall. Ever heard of boiling pitch?
- Too many "X saves Y from certain death" moments.
- Lyanna killed a giant. That's awesome. Unfortunately, that's the only giant we saw in the episode although there were at least 8-10 or more in previous shots of the undead camp.
- The quiet cat-and-mouse moments with Arya vs. undead and later Beric+Sandor vs. undead seemed a bit out of place-- and long-- considering the carnage that was going on around them. They were enjoyable, but just seemed a little odd to me.
- The plot armor was just too strong for the main characters, sorry.
- The Unsullied weapon of choice seems particularly unsuited to fighting a horde where most of the time you shouldn't have space to swing it.
- The Christ-figure pose of Beric as he dies was just too much / too obvious. It's always seemed to me that The Lord of Light is most similar to Christian theology, and the Beric pose just seemed over-the-top.
- Sansa and Tyrion just hanging out and chatting while hiding from the undead attacking Winterfell's women and children in the Crypts.
- I know Theon was absolved and his character had run its course, but charging at the Night King? Why a suicide attack? How about, I don't know, just standing in front of Bran so the Night King would have to kill him first. And why didn't anybody arm him (and others) with dragonglass considering he was at the location they were expecting/hoping the NK would arrive? Of all the places to have dragonglass, that seemed like the place to have it.
And probably more.
Let's hope we can move on to the more interesting battle for the Iron Throne. I'm glad the Night King / end of the world arc at least seems to be over.
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I had many issues with the episode. Not least:
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LMAO @ pic
I had compression artifacts when I tried to watch it the first time but mine was due to the live broadcast by my cable provider. I can't stand my shitty cable provider but unfortunately I have to keep them. Watching it On Demand there were none though.
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Dungeons & Dragons concepts are ironically too much to handle and comprehend for the showrunners (also nicknamed D&D).
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I was so expecting at least a small conversation between Bran and the NK. Giving some kind of explanation or whatever.
But hey! Last weeks episode taught me a few things:
1) I want to get cremated when I die, just in case...
2) Playing loads of stealth games pays off
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At least we can now look forward to this...
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This battle was epic, this episode got me on the edge of my seat the whole time. Lot a people got to be the hero, I like how Theon redeemed himself.
Awesome episode, the mad king finally died.
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That battle line tho.
cav
arty
footsoldiers
cav gets slaughtered
"let's stop firing the catapults"
footsoldiers do not move up and stay behind arty
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the battle was so boring and it had many plotholes. all the characters were surrounded by emenies and they were basically dying and after the cut the mysteriously kill hundreds and live on. that is some major bullshit.
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So... that ending was cool but a lil bit underwhelming, i hoped the NK would survive longer, but i think he might survive after all
Also, a small GA for your time
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