Feel bad about what happened to you, and i though i lived in a country were police were just another word for thief/bandits D: Good luck in court dood! D:
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holly shit, i would just panic about this
i dont know if android says time and date when an app is installed but i think not, anyway i would just report this to court directly, that's worst then childish, its just stupid, if they are police officers and they cant take someone seriously how can a country be safe if the "law" does not give a shit
they also taked your personal phone with no proof that it is or not your company phone and... i have NO WORDS! people go to police because they need help, i personaly think that probably some kid got his hands on your phone and someone was not able to be responsable about that but YOU CAN TAKE THAT AS PROOF, take photos of your phone with the calls they made and if you can get in court with them just ask to compare the phone numbers with the ones they have saved on their phones, or even try to call to those number and ask whos talking, if they have any friend police officers and if they are able to proof what they did
i never tried this so i'm not sure how that works but just because they are the "law" it doesnt mean that they can do whatever they want, they should just go to jackass and make movies insted of playing with real law
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wow, such basic as respect also includes apolagies so that should not be criminal offence
oh well, pay them in the same coin and call the phone numbers they called with your phone and try to understand why (probably wont solve much) or you could create a small text telling what happened, what you did wrong and how the "law" also reacted by evanding privacy (not sure if police is covered by that but if they are i dont agree), etc and post them in public places like parks for example, you dont need to mention names or locations (better if you avoid that) also dont mention who you are, there should be nothing they can do about it because no names are mentioned and no victim's name
its just some ideas but its better then do nothing! also if you are going ahead with the text remember that you are the victim and there should be that impression in the text/message and dont post the messages by yourself, ask someone that would cover you if someone asks who did the text
sharing the message with allot of people from your country should work as well but most people would not even bother looking
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i forgot but look up if this is legal first or since you are gonna talk with the lawyer tomorrow ask him if you can do those (i personally think that text would work because they would be try to avoid things like this from now on...) but if possible doing the text with references would be even more effect because its not like if they are afraid of showing to public, at least they did not cared at all when you phone was taken
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well if it's proven you were put in such distressful situation by police abuse, you have good ground to have your case under a better light. and if you have no history of verbal abuses a court would probably see how you simply broke out because of the absurd situation they put you in...
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Go to press or the office of Rzecznik Praw Obywatelskich. It's about the only efficient thing you can do now. Also, take the receipt they gave you when taking phone, billings from phone operator proving it was used when in custody and raise a big stink. Better yet, get real lawyer, not take internet forum advice. Also, why I am writing this in English? ._. Oh, right, forum rules :P
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wtf! that's disturbing to say the least, I'm glad I didn't have to deal with police the two times I was in Poland...
btw, if you got that letter about registering the company and it was a suspected fraud, that WAS in fact a business matter, not private/personal, so the police claim was a bullshit from the start!
best of luck dude, it would be great to hear those pigs got what they deserve in the end!
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i live in middle europe and its the same with police, people got punched at the police station and if they go to court they get reported for resistance .. the more you accuse them the harder you get accused and their word is always more
(i hope its understandable with my poor english)
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Can I have your steam account if they kill you?
Wonder how the criminals knew you started a business so you were likely to buy exactly that story/fake registry fee... those who sent the scam probably sit/work in the 'business registration office'. Might want to check if the cop is a relative to anyone working there before you sue them/him/anyone.
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How they knew is simple - every company in PL has to mandatory register in government companies registry. The government registry is freely viewable to every citizen via internet. Such a scam companies are a common thing in PL - they view gov registry, copy adresses and mass spam all new companies with their fake/scam mails.
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to be fair... it common knowledge that nearly all police don;t care/ give a damn about those they consider trivia,
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Holy hell dude. . .i wish i could teleport straight to Poland,right now,to wherever you in fact live,and molotov the shit outta that pig pen. typical case of police brutality and bureaucratic neglect and exploitation.sonsa bitches,i hope none of them earns a proper pension.
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You made three things wrong.
You should have taken call register from the operator - where is call time, how long the call lasted, and number under which it was made - it would be undeniable evidence that these calls were made while your phone was at the police station. And report it not at the station where it happened, but at the station higher in the ranks or at the DA office (prokuratura in Polish) Always problems with anything report one step higher that it actually happened.
When your phone was confiscated you should ask them to put up in writing what paragraph they suspect that you broke. Because there is no law which prohibits you to use company phone for private calls. (unless your employer tells you that you can't use it that way - which is not a case here) But (in theory) you should pay income tax for a time when your phone was used for private matters (which is also not a case around here - since you were to report that you suspect a crime against your company - so checking law was company's business) I use company's phone for five years and I was at few police stations and never had any problems with it - only once they asked me to turn it off. Also the police cannot lock your phone as evidence if you refuse it, unless they have a court order (which they can get in less than an hour, and in that case they will keep it locked up for a year or so - so it is not recommended) But you might say that you need to lock up private part of your phone (for example you want to make sure that bank app is turned off) - and turn off your phone. Or just in case install this - http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2207126 (too lazy to make a clicky)
Never, ever you should yell at the police in Poland. It is against the law. Calling them out, using vulgar language and so on - it is all against the law. (Obraza funkcjonariusza na służbie - do roku pozbawienia wolności - nie mylić z karą więzienia. Kara więzienia to co innego i występuje na okres ponad 1 roku. Pozbawienie wolności to np. prace społeczne, areszt domowy lub areszt zwykły który najczęściej się odbywa w więzieniu) All people doing job as public servants (Police, Fire Department, Members of Parliament or the guys who count votes during elections - the list is quite long) are under special protection and all kind of assault against them - even violation of physical immunity (in other words - touching them without permission) or verbal violence (yelling at them, using in public words which may indicate that they are unsuitable to perform their job, or using vulgar words to describe them) is punishable by law in Poland - but only when they are on duty, and it must be directed at specific person (so shouting "All Police Officers are Prostitutes, female genitals and male genitals" using most vulgar polish words is legal - This is the country I live in)
A tak na marginesie - spróbuj się powołać na ograniczoną poczytalność związaną z nagłym wstrząsem emocjonalnym. Niech w Tworkach, czy gdzieś jakiś lekarz ci podstępluje zaświadczenie że masz skłonność do wzburzeń emocjonalnych. Wtedy jest szansa że skierują ciebie na leczenie na zasadach ambulatoryjnych (czyli będziesz musiał chodzić regularnie do psyhiatry) Nie jest to rozwiązanie idealne, ale ciągle pozwoli ci na uzyskanie zaświadczenia o niekaralności.
No i ostatni sposób. Pozwij policję o korzystanie z twojego telefonu. Bilingi i rejest wejść na komendę będą po twojej stronie (policja ma obowiązek notować kto i o której godzinie wchodzi na komisariat) Zgłoś sprawę do prokuratury. Jeżeli wydalą tych policjantów ze służby (co jest wątpliwe - musiałbyś udowodnić że spowodowali znaczną szkodę - wysoki rachunek za połączenia na 0-700, konieczność naprawy lub wymiany telefonu, lub to że przez brak internetu nie możesz wykonywać swoich obowiązków w pracy) to możesz złorzyć wniosek o warunkowe umożenie sprawy, ze względu na to iż funkcjonariusze działali na twoją szkodę, utracili przez to pracę, więc nie można ich kwalifikować jako funkcjonariuszy publicznych - czyli za znieważenie wtedy groziłby ci tylko proces cywilny. Gorzej za stawianie oporu podczas zatrzymania. Dowiedz się o monitoring na komisariacie i postaraj się o zabezpieczenie nagrania - jeżeli tego nie zrobią to oskarż ich przed sądem o to że zniszczyli dowody, bo to świadczyło o twojej niewinności - raczej przez te zniszczenie dowodów nic nie będzie, ale dasz podstawę do uznania że jest uzasadniona wątpliwość czy stawiałeś opór, a ciągle niepewności interpretuje się na korzyść oskarżonego. Albo podważysz wiarygodność policjantów, albo to będzie ich słowo przeciw twojemu słowu. I tutaj sąd najczęściej bierze stronę policji. Nagłośnienie sprawy w Uwadze czy Fakcie najczęściej nic nie daje. Sędziowie mają po 30-40 lat i gdzieś to co o nich mówią w mediach.
A kwestia tych świstków papieru o "rejestrze firm polskich" i podobnych firmach - chyba nie do ukarania w Polsce. Zgłosiłem sprawę do prokuratury - umożone ze względu na brak znamion czynu zabronionego. Jest dopisek że to reklama i nie straszą konsekwencjami zabronionymi w piśmie. Możliwe że byliby do ruszenia poprzez UOKiK (nieuczciwa i wprowadzająca w błąd reklama) ale już nie chciało mi się tracić na nich więcej czasu - miałem swoją robotę, a te ich "reklamy" świetnie się nadają na rozpałkę w kominku.
I na koniec - weź poprawkę na to że ja zajmuję się głównie obsługą prawną nieruchomości i nie jestem prawnikiem z wykształcenia. Z sądami i policją miałem wielokrotnie doczynienia w pracy i raz poza pracą, no i niejedną ustawę czy rozporządzenie musiałem przeczytać od deski do deski, więc trochę tego doświadczenia mam.
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For your english part of post:
@1. I already requested all the billings, but from what I heard they won't mean a thing. I coul use them to put up "proces cywilny" (civil case) for what money they used but they mean nothing in case of me insulting police officer.
@2 I will remember it, buit I hope I will never have to use it ;p
@3 I know - now I know it more than ever, but try walking in my shoes - I tried to do a right thing, got bashed by stupid bureaucracy, I endured, they took my phone for no reason, I endured, I tried to solve it even with all their fake bullshit, I endured, they started to threathen me - there's only this much one can endure... I know that even verbal violence is not an answer, but FFS - if you read this all, is it not normal to not even get angry but to get furious?
Co do polskich części - Tworki i te sprawy poza kwestią - przy mojej robocie choćby wspomnienie o żółtych papierach równa się zwolnienie z pracy. Jedna z największych międzynarodowych korpo nie będzie się bawiła w czekani, czy moga mnie zatrudniać czy nie.
Pozywać nie ma co - chyba, że za wykorzystanie całego darmowego i tak niby wg umowy, pakietu na internet. Mam 500 minut free i tylko 1/3 wykorzystali, a samemu wydzwaniac nie bede zeby wykorzystac - abo bralem drogi, zeby smartfona kupic za 200 a nie za 800zl.
Monitoringu na komisariacie nie ma - jak przyszliśmy pierwszy raz to powiedzieliśmy, że do tej firmy co to nam te gówna wysyła jest masa zgłoszeń, wystarczy nazwę na googlu wpisać i zobaczą - ale oni, że nie mogą, bo nie mają ani PC ani internetów.
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Nie będę już pisał po angielsku, bo myślę po polsku i szybciej idzie mi pisanie po Polsku a nie mam teraz za dużo czasu.
Zaświadczenie z Tworek - to nie jest to samo co żółte papiery. Nie chodzi o stwierdzenie że jesteś chory psychicznie, ale że miałeś ograniczoną poczytalność ze względu na krótkotrwałe wzburzenie psychiczne. Słowo klucz - krótkotrwałe. Skłonność do wzburzeń emocjonalnych (czy coś w tym stylu - nie jestem lekarzem) oznacza że jak ktoś zacznie ciebie naciskać to masz skłonność do krzyczenia i rzucania mięsem. Na co dzień jesteś normalny, ale tutaj byłeś wzburzony - i jak sam napisałeś, każdy ma jakiś punkt gdzie pęka. Bezprawna konfiskata telefonu, użytkowanie go do celów prywatnych przez funkcjonariusza publicznego, (tak przy okazji - art 231 par. 1 - "funkcjonariusz publiczny, który przekraczając swoje uprawnienia lub nie dopełniając obowiązków, działa na szkodę interesu publicznego lub prywatnego, podlega karze pozbawienia wolności do lat 3" Nie ma zdefiniowane jak duża musi być ta szkoda, oraz czy jest materialna, naruszenie poczucia bezpieczeństwa też jest szkodą - a jak miałeś prywatne rzeczy na telefonie i ktoś się nim bawił to można to pod ten paragraf podciągnąć - ale do tego raczej byś potrzebował niezłego prawnika.) a na koniec były jeszcze groźby (groźby prawne - zagrożenie pociągnięciem do odpowiedzialności karnej - legalne, ale nieuzasadnione. Nie pisz w żadnym piśmie "groźby bezprawne" - to zupełnie co innego) Przyznaję - ryzykowne. Ale ja bym nawet chwili się nie wahał. Może dlatego że jeżeli będę miał żółte papiery to pracodawca złoży tylko wniosek o dopłatę za zatrudnianie osób niepełnosprawnych intelektualnie i na tym się to skończy. A brak zaświadczenia o niekaralności - i nie mogę brać udziału w 90% zleceń jakie mamy.
Ja bym też założył sprawę cywilną o bezprawne korzystanie z telefonu. Nie po to aby ją wygrać, ale po to aby stanowiła formę nacisku na sprawę karną. Może uda się dojść do porozumienia w stylu - wy wycofacie pozew to i ja wycofam.
No i na każdym etapie składaj wniosek o umorzenie sprawy ze względu na niską szkodliwość społeczną czynu. Zdenerwowany nakrzyczałeś na policjantów - więc co tak naprawdę się stało?
Chyba też warto by było się skontaktować z prawnikiem lub radcą prawnym. W prawie liczy się każde słowo. Uwaliliśmy raz w firmie w imieniu klienta podwyżkę opłaty za użytkowanie wieczyste bo w jednym miejscu jedna osoba użyła słowa "naliczenie" zamiast "obliczenie" - a to są inne czynności prawne. Sam możesz podobnie się wkopać poprzez jakąś podobną pomyłkę. Lub z drugiej strony - jeżeli ktoś po drugiej stronie popełni podobny błąd - prawnik może to wyłapać. Tylko jak szukasz prawnika - pytaj się po znajomych, rodzinie i osobach do których masz zaufanie. Widziałem prawnika który przez sześć lat kręcił dookoła sprawy która była do wygrania jednym pismem, tylko po to aby doić swoich klientów. Ale on nie zarabiał na wygraniu przez nich sprawy, ale na prowadzeniu jej - więc wolał kręcić się w kółko. Inny przez cztery lata sprzedawał zamki na piasku swoim klientom. Ludzie stracili ok. 3-5 milionów na tym. Prawnik zarobił ok. pół miliona. Oczyszczalnia ścieków dla miasta powstała 4 lata później. Musisz znaleźć takiego prawnika który będzie reprezentował twoje interesy a nie swoje. (od razu mówię - od spraw karnych nie znam takiego, nigdy nie potrzebowałem)
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google/android has this functionality built-in
https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3265955?hl=en
well it works if you have your device associated with your Google account
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You start screaming in the face of a police officer, and you're going to be arrested, not really a surprise there. Get a lawyer and take the department to court, though I'd suggest not including the arrest as a damage.
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They say Poland is free and communism is there no more.
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First of all sorry to hear that but like others said you should not have insulted the police but instead of idiots and morons you should have used other words.
In any case you probably wont go in jail and you wont pay any fine because you can prove that it was not you who made those calls and downloaded all that stuff.
1) Get a lawyer!
2)
Its very simple:
-Phone company has all the logs you need.
-If you just show to the judge when the calls were made - YOU WIN. Because you couldnt have called from that phone number when police had the phone!!!
Some people from police will also lose their jobs over this!
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already requested al billings from mobile company, going to lawyer tommorow. Sadly I heard it won't change anything - because even if my yelling on cop lying straight to my face was just - i did yell, hence insulted him, hence even if he was wrong i'm to blame for insult.
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This can't help you directly... but... if you about to wim civil case for you phone... this meens that somebody in the police must be punished... and thats will make them more accceptable to out court agreement for both cases ;)
Some thimes best deffance is attack...
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While i'm sorry for your misfortune i can't help but chuckle bitterly thinking of the people who i hear in IRL every day saying stuff like "trust the police" "the police are on your side" "the police can help you" etc. If the law in your country is as shitty as it is in mine, and from your story it might be even worse, taking them to court won't help you. Like others have suggested above, your best bet to get out of this might be to try and stir shit up, newspapers and tv channels would probably be all over something like this and if you're persistent enough they might let the whole thing go just to shut you up. I know it's not the justice you're looking for but i think at this point just getting out of this mess is more important.
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Sad story, but I dunno what did you expect. Thats how it looks like in Poland. If you live in this country than you should already know that local police is not meant for supporting rightful citizens and any form of argueing with them have no results at all or even brings bad consequences. You've get a painful lesson. You are not the first and not the last. Road to hell is full of good intentions, and there is a lot of things that you will not break through with them. Ofc I'm sorry for you, though you were really dumb. I know it's sick but this country has a lot of illnesses, and sadly you can't change it by your own, though the justice is by your side. All you can do is adapt and learn how to deal with it. In current situation I recommend you stop fighting with them unless you got witnesses, strong evidences that you can proof, fat wallet for lawyers and determination, and even if think twice about it. Otherwise be meek, if you don't have such incidents on your record you get lower fine or none at all. If you were not sentenced any before your ass will not get "the only sure social from this country" aka jail. Good luck with those bastards.
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"Thats how it looks like in Poland"? Meh, I can name 5 countries this instant where trying to do similar thing on police station would have far worse consequences. Polish police can be dumb and backwards, but at least in bigger cities it starts to meet modern standards...
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Ofc Poland doesn't have an exclusivity. There are no standards, rednecks are also in bigger cities.
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you gave them sharpnel, you load the gun, You gave them the gun
and (given that they were gilty free)
THEY SHOT at you...
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major police stations do have them. Yet minor ones (like one I attended to) don't have them at all. Heck - there was not even PC or internet connection, when we wanted to show them that these scam emails are serious thjing all over interwebs.
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Wow that sucks. I don't think I'd be able to keep my temper under those circumstances either.
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Oh my god. This kind of shit would make me so fucking mad.
You should post it on http://www.reddit.com/r/tifu/ for likely internet points.
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i am sorry friend. that must have been awful. you should have stayed calm at all times and insisted on them to give you the proper time to sort it all out. because in the state the world currently is you cant trust/rely on anyone that easily
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I'm very sorry to hear this Zelg. I do not know anything of Polish law, but I do know basic human emotion. In your case you're being accused of lying which would naturally upset you. The fact you were being accused of lying, and you were not lying would have upset you even more. This is where I don't think the Polish law makes any sense. The abuse of power potential is too great as all an officer has to do is provoke a citizen, and then cite what I consider a silly law. Resisting arrest is a bullshit add on in and of itself for a great percentage of arrests.
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Whole story:
FRIDAY:
My fiance started her own company 3 weeks ago. Last week she received a mail - inside was something looking like an official letter from government, with official stamps etc - calling her to pay 195 PLN (46EUR) for mandatory registration in "Polish Companies Registry. Below was a blanket to send money via bank transfer. On the other side of sheet of paper there was written with small letters that "This is just an advertisement. No payment is mandatory. We are not government agency, but just private company".
WEDNESDAY:
We went with that letter to police to report a fraud attempt. 1st policeman told us it's not a fraud, because there's this text on the other side. We said we'd like to report anyway and let a court decide if it's a fraud or not. He told us we'll have to wait for his supervisor.
His supervisor comes, we tell whole story over again - he says he cannot take our statement cause it's no Police work and we should go to civil court if we want to. I take out my smartphone and google through polish law codexes and show him a point that it's not a matyter for civil court but for the police. Very unhappy he writes down a statement then he asks me for a smartphone I just googled it on. I think he wants to copy what paragraph number it is or something, but no - he puts a smartphone into an evidence bag. WTF? - I ask. "You used your company's smartphone for private matters, which is against the law.". "It's not company's smartphone! It's my private phone. Plus I bought it over 1.5 year ago while company is up for just 1.5 week!". "In this case we will have to verify it - if it's really private smartphone, not a company one. You can take it back in 24 hours". "Can I at least have my SIM card back?". "No, SIM card is part of protected evidence now". He gives me piece of paper to come back tommorow for my phone.
THURSDAY :
I go to pick up my phone. They give it back to me - batterry dead. I go back t home, charge it - and what do I see? 26 calls made while phone was there, whole internet package used, shitload of some useless shitty apps from "money-for-download" pages installed. I go back to police to report it. What do I hear? "You probably made all these calls and downloaded all this stuff right now, while changing phone clock, just to blame police". For next few minutes I try to calmly resolve this issue - but I hear that if I don't stop talking I'm the one who they will arrest for fraud on them - as I obviously try to scam them for compensation right now. The moment I hear it I break - I scream on an idiot who tells me this that he must be a moron, that the fucking Android would change all timers the moment I'd change time, and that some fucking asshole from their fucking police station is just a thief that decided to use smartphone which was suposed to be evidence to save himself some money and earn some fucking credits on some shitty website for downloading shitty aps.
Next thing I know I lie on the ground handcuffed behind my back. They take me to prosecutors and I find out I'm charged with insulting police officer (because I used vulgar language) and resisting an arrest (yeah - me fat, unhealthy nerd resisted 3 bigass muscled cops who were lying on me and handcuffing me). And I hear I now face a threat of big fine or up to one year of jail time... So yeah - that's my story - if you read up to here the GA cove is hidden right after Thursday.
AFTER NECRO EDIT
OK... idk why the hell someone necroed such an old topic, you're an idiot dear sir, but as for update how things ended up:
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