Did you make sure to blacklist me yet?
Both blacklisting and whitelisting are unnecessary features and should be removed (and yep, I'm certain some people will add me to this or that list because of this comment). :)
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But I have no one on my blacklist, so I can't answer the poll. :3
As to your blacklists, I don't think anyone (or almost anyone) who engaged in the debate blacklisted you. It's usually the people observing.
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I do agree that is nice to see discussions without insults.
Thanks for the chance.
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I don't have anyone on my blacklist right now and I'm sorry, but I'm still going to be searching for that special someone.
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It's hard because this is internet and everyone here come from different places, have different cultures, different experiences, and live in different environments.
But I understand your words, there are times that I feel the same. Maybe one day blacklist won't be necessary anymore on SteamGifts. :)
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I'm also going to make a speech like this when I want to be whitelisted by everyone :^)
Reverse psychology is my favorite.
Anyway, I don't really have much of an opinion on it. It's just a video game giveaway forums, I don't even know why there's drama in the first place. Being 'blacklisted' by some guy you don't know is so... irrelevant.
I already witness enough weird drama doing my controversial work - when I log in to my computer I don't care for drama. I think I blacklisted like one guy cause he blatantly scammed me for some random 25 cents game (wtf.)
Anyyyway >shakes and clears my mind with Christmas, guys with great smiles, huge boobies< awhhnn bliss ~
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It really was not my intent to be whitelisted by anyone reading the thread - I don't really enter and GA's so being whitelisted doesn't really provide me any benefit - the benefit (hopefully) is to change how readers view other members here and discussions that transpire on the forums.
As someone who is a former US Military member, I volunteered to defend and support the constitution of the USA. Understandably this is a global forum - but I am still a supporter of free speech (even though many countries do not have free speech). To me blacklisting people or banning people based on their comments (regardless of how rude) is an enemy of free speech and I will battle that enemy wherever it may reside.
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BL is someone executing his right to not listen or dislike you. In other words free speach doesn't mean there are no consequences.
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You can't BL someone in real life. If you are in the gym and someone is talking about things that you don't like - you can't walk up to them and say 'Blacklisted!' and then stop hearing their speech. You can try to ignore that speech, put headphones on, change gym times, change gyms, etc., but that is not the same thing as blacklisting someone. While you have the right to ignore my speech, I have the right to be heard in my chosen medium.
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Pretty much the same as breaking all contacts (with the script that hides posts from select users). I don't let him in to spaces under my control and use hearing filter elsewhere. In no means I violate yours free speach right
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When you sign up to (and) become a member of an open forum - you are operating in an environment that (should) support the ideological freedoms of its users (I say should since that is my personal belief). Obviously most places on the internet have a terms of service and will remove racist comments and the like through censoring free speech - and that is their right as the forum owner. When my speech is censored by a script that removes it entirely or through the comment being removed or the user being banned or whatever - that violates the concept of freedom of speech (it does not violate it legally since the owner of the forum is legally able to censor that speech).
If we both go to a public space in the USA, you cannot legally remove my speech from the area. You can put on headphones, you can put in ear plugs, you can leave the public space, you can talk over me - but you cannot silence my speech or remove it. The internet is a little bit different since the forum is privately owned property and free speech laws do not apply to privately owned property either.
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If we both go to a public space in the USA, you cannot legally remove my speech from the area.
So if you are inciting people to grab weapons and start shooting black people for example, that would be fine ? I'm pretty sure that's illegal
Anyway I don't think it's an accurate metaphor for blacklists. Rather it should be something like "I'm having a party at my place, and I don't like you so you're not invited".
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Well no, you can't legally use speech to incite violence (although to be fair we have seen a lot of that this political season with no arrests made)... but you can legally use speech to be racist.
And that party analogy may be better if you are limiting site membership. Otherwise what you are really saying is "I'm having a party at my place (the site), everyone is invited, but only a select few are allowed to talk"
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I mean it doesn't really prevent you from talking, they just don't want you in their giveaways. It can be discouraging but it doesn't actually stop you from spreading whatever opinion caused them to blacklist you in the forum.
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Somewhat agreed on 1st paragraph: right to manage mine property takes precedence over yours right to speach, not violates it (but this may be language barrier here)
Intresting. If I use my freedom of speech to retransmit yours voice, but phase shifted by 180 degress (effectively muting you outside of speakers system circle), am I allowed to do that? (just curious)
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but surely blacklisting you does not prevent you from speaking? - that is just a measure that someone is using to say that they would prefer not to hang around you and have you enter their giveaways - much like you cannot be friends with everyone and not everyone wants to be your friend (just to clarify I did not BL you - but feel that you may be forgetting that some are not in america and thus do not follow that constitution - and have different ideas on what freedom of speech means - for instance we have magna carta, but I am not naieve enough to follow a document like that :) - the world has moved on :P
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The world does not fall under the US Constitution. What is funny is when people talk about education being a basic human right.... access to healthcare is a basic human right.... while those are admirable things, the freedom of speech (to me) is a basic human right regardless of what your local government says. That is just my belief though.
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Freedom of speech is a duty the government swears to uphold to it's citizens not a social or societal contract, it has never and will never pertain to any private property physical or digital, be it gyms, cafes, restaurants, websites, forums etc. Sorry, that's a pet peeve of mine, when people just claim "This is still 'murica, freedom of speech ftw!" to say anything and everything they want.
I blacklisted you on sep 30. but for the first time ever I honestly have no idea why. Removed you from it because you do not appear to be racist/ignorant/hate-spewing. Sorry if I made a mistake
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I previously posted "that violates the concept of freedom of speech (it does not violate it legally since the owner of the forum is legally able to censor that speech)." so I understand the pet peeve you have when people think their public rights are also protected in/on private property.
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Derp I missed it. Now I'm even more confused about the BL, do you have an evil twin maybe? O_O
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This last post of yours made it confusing for me if you are aware of this or not, so I'm sorry if this comes off as preachy, but...
The world does not need to fall under the US Constitution, but it would do the US a world of good if they always seemed intent on following the Universal Declaration of Human Rights strictly to the letter, since you know... the US signed it too. ;)
If you scroll to article 19, you can see that freedom of speech is universal, it's not an US thing. Following the other articles is kinda key too, though. ;)
As for the thread itself, I agree that blacklisting for simple disagreements is petty and childish, I myself am only prone to blacklist someone for the way they handled themselves with other users than just me, for the simple reason that I can be more objective about it, but to each their own. Emphasis on the way they expressed themselves, more than anything, because yes, I have and I will continue to blacklist users if I firmly believe they are not just expressing their opinion (however I may dislike it), but rather being a complete ass to just about anyone who happens to disagree with them. There's a huge difference, in my honest opinion.
Also, I also believe your analogy, as stated by prus and Tempete above, is quite flawed, no offence. I wouldn't equate blacklisting someone to depriving them of their right to freedom of speech, because they retain their exact same rights in the forum, as you yourself would be incurring in the same, as stated in your OP:
11 unfortunate leechers are the only individuals who reside on my blacklist
If blacklisting those individuals meant the same as depriving them of their basic human rights, you'd be in the wrong too, which in no way I believe this to be true. ;)
Furthermore, I believe the flaw of your analogy stems from the fact that you (and not just you, but a lot of people out there) seem to confuse an open forum with a fully public forum. This is open to registration, and thus open to the general public, yes. But the same can be said by any website/organization/association that is open to the general public, doesn't mean that by enrolling/registering you do not abide by specific rules pertaining to said website/organization/association. The same can be said about this forum, it is subject to its own subset of private rules, which you agree and accept upon registration. So, I myself wouldn't describe this as public space, this isn't owned by the public, our taxes don't cover the running costs of the website. ;)
All that said, absolutely no qualms whatsoever with this:
Stand up for what you believe in, fight for those who cannot defend themselves, listen and be heard... and above all else celebrate the differences of others whether that is race, color, creed, religion, beliefs, or opinions. The real secret of the world is that you do not limit others through racism, religious hate or silencing opposition to your opinion - you truly only limit yourself.
A big +1 to that. ;)
P.S.: This wasn't meant as nitpicking, I apologize if it came off that way, but I felt those were important points to be made. In other words, I was standing up for what I believe in. ;)
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You do realize that despite all of those nations having signed that declaration - only few actually adhere to it. There are many countries with no freedom of speech and many still that have a censored version of free speech.
I also mentioned "that violates the concept of freedom of speech (it does not violate it legally since the owner of the forum is legally able to censor that speech)." in a previous post. So I am quite aware of the legal right ownership provides.
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I am (sadly) fully aware of this, but shouldn't that make it even more relevant to refer the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, instead of the US constitution? The US themselves (sadly) haven't always followed (and in some instances to some degree still don't) each and every one of the 30 articles, and well, no actual good reason not to.
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What if some guy is wearing christmas clothes, has a great smile and huge boobies?.................oh wait, that's Santa already, nevermind. Yeah Christmas are fun times :3
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You were on my whitelist before this because I like seeing people try and have actual discussions on these forums, and you prove with your words here that that's what you want. You sir are a good man
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I've been called a lot of things in real life and on the internet.... "a good man" was not very high up on the list!
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Wait a minute. Are you trying to suggest that my opinion (that I fully agree with) may be questionable? Preposterous!
I don't agree with you on the disagreement==BL thesis. If that was the case I'd already have the "Ultimate Demon King" achievement, alas long road before me...
Fact is, majority of BL growth for me was after posting giveaways on the forum, not when getting into debate (nor even being plainly evil)
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"If that was the case I'd already have the "Ultimate Demon King" achievement"
Challenge accepted.... first to the finish then!
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Lol, that may be easy win for you. At current rate I'd need ~4k giveaways - that not gonna happen anytime soon - and fast lane to cheevo is no fun to go )
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You got me thinking - if you start to spread the word that you're 100% don't believe in the blacklist for disagreeing phenomena, then if someone disagrees you and tries to blacklist you actually proves your point! So they have to whitelist you to prove how wrong you are :P
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Why you spoil my clever plan to always win? Reported for leaking! ;
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I think I know what you're hinting at :D Thanks for the giveaway btw ;)
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Why are you so convinced that people blacklisted you because you disagree with them?
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I have had numerous discussions on the forums here...
I have had responses of "welcome to my BL".
I have seen a direct correlation between my forum posts and additional BL counts on my stats page.
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Granted. For those occasions where people said something like "welcome to my BL" it is obvious. But the rest? It can be a coincidence. There are so many bad reasons to add someone to the blacklist that it has not to be disagreement. Without any data to back it up you may make a complain for a situation which is not given.
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It absolutely can be a coincidence - although often times it ends up being not since you can go to someones profile and open up one of their currently running GA's and see that you cannot enter it. Although it is possible that people may blacklist someone not based on the disagreement itself but in the manner that the disagreement is stated.
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Well that second sentence already describes one of the possible other reasons. In the first line commenting just mean visibility. From there it can be anything: You have a green avatar. I don't like it. You have a star as avatar I don't like it. Your username is the abbreviation of a racist group in my country. I don't like it. I checked you SG profile and noticed several times the number 2. I fear the number 2 so I don't like you (before you say this is ridicolous, there are people who fear the number 4 although for other reasons). And probably the most important reasons is really how one states his own opinion:
Case A: Gentle user, I respect your opinion although I have a slightly different one. Please let me explain.
Case B: Okay head, stop talking to me since you don't know .
You also have to consider that even if you yourself think otherwise people may see it as rude (don't know since I can't remember a single comment from you ....). I remember a thread where someone argued that the phrase "Fuck off and die." can not be considered rude.
Other than that. What is the problem any way? The only thing a blacklist means is: I don't like you. You are no longer allowed to come to my parties.
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While I agree with you, I feel the need to take the opposite side in order to have a proper debate.
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okay I'll blacklist you....
shit I hit the wrong button
guess you're whitelisted now ;)
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I blacklist assholes. Look, I get it, you have a strong opinion that you may or may not think is a fact, but cmon,
stop waving it around my face. think of the children!
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I seriously think that blacklisting someone should mean that they can't participate in your GAs, and you can't in theirs... Then we'd see how many people actually have any conviction behind their BLs, especially against a generous user like you..
That said - how do you know why people blacklist you? Assuming it's because they don't like your ideas, rather than how you come across when presenting them, seems a little arrogant, no?
For what it's worth, I've seen a number of comments from you which seemed unnecessarily brusk.
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I've seen a few people say this and I used to think the same, but I've changed my mind. Yea I don't give away a lot of games, but if I'm giving something away and some person wants it for the +1, the profitz, or just genuinely wants it then I'm fine with them trying to win it. Regardless of what they think of me. If they think I win too many games and want to keep me from winning their games because that and do so by blacklisting me, then that is their prerogative. In the end I'm giving it away... if I really cared who got it or wanted it to be special in some way I'd use my whitelist.
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Nice try bruh ,
I'm not gonna taint my clean sheet of blacklist .
I'm gonna keep it empty to infinity and beyond. JK :3
On a serious note about different opinion.,
I've come to an understanding that on the internet "Nothing is true,everything is permitted".
Also may i ask what is your ratio of whitelist to blacklist?
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After making this post it is about 2:1 but before it was 1:1 - although I did not make this post as the means to fish for whitelist adds.
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What is this blacklist you talk of, never heard of it :)
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OH GOD you're amazing, bump so huge for you its gonna blow your cock off
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Couldn't add to to any of them... because you were already on my WL ;3
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What a sign of the times. A time when disagreement = blacklist. If there ever once was a time and place where people actively engaged in the exchange of ideas, this is neither the time nor the place. At steamgifts, where people are so molded in ideology and character... where everyone has already created a cemented idea of how everything in the world should work - and damn everyone who doesn't agree to their blacklist - I cannot help but feel so jealous of those individuals and their staunch ignorance to think that their opinion is beyond questionable.
So as I continue to be added to other people's blacklists for having a different opinion, let me tell you all how none of you are on my blacklist... see I celebrate the differences of ideology, I do not punish it. 11 unfortunate leechers are the only individuals who reside on my blacklist, not the people who insult me on the forums, not the people who are rude on the forums, and certainly not the people who I disagree with on these forums and have debates - in fact most people who provide an insult free debate are added to my WL.
Stand up for what you believe in, fight for those who cannot defend themselves, listen and be heard... and above all else celebrate the differences of others whether that is race, color, creed, religion, beliefs, or opinions. The real secret of the world is that you do not limit others through racism, religious hate or silencing opposition to your opinion - you truly only limit yourself.
MAKE MY BLACKLIST GREAT AGAIN!
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