I'm going to build a new PC and i have some questions. The majority usage is for 3D modelling and rendering (architecture).
This is the rig i set: http://es.pcpartpicker.com/p/dcRGvK

Questions:

  1. Will the GTX970 be capable to run all games in middle-high settings on 1080p for 4-5 years? I don't want to spend 360€ and have to change it in 2 years...
  2. I want to do OC to de processor to reduce render times, and I read that RAM with high frequency will give me more stability. But I don't know sure, I'm planning on get a DDR4 3000 instead the 2400, but there is a difference of 30-50€ that I could spend in other components.

GA for helping:
http://www.steamgifts.com/giveaway/aQnG0/
http://www.steamgifts.com/giveaway/4kwCh/

8 years ago

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th gtx970 is good gc but no one is able to guarantee you it will meet your requirements in terms of time.If there will be stagnation on market and no one will develop "gamechanging" graphic card technology you will be able to play at 1080 on high in most of the cases, medium settings shouldnt be a problem. About ram Im not sure if its worth you can always OC from 2400 to 3000, I have gskill ripjaw 3000 cl 15 overclocked to 3600 and I gained ~2% score in 3dmark so if you can play on medium-high it shouldnt be a problem.

8 years ago
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I'm not a fanatic of graphics, i don't mind playing in middle.

I read that maybe shader model 6.0 will come next year.

Thank you for the explanation, you helped me.

8 years ago
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You need to adjust texture settings in 1-2 years down from max to some high. The 970 suffers both from just moderate bandwith and decreased VRAM (3,5GB). You have to decrease texture settings for 1440p/2180p already for todays games. 1080p should be safe for 1year+.

And if you're doing CAD work you want not to limited by your VRAM eigther. Better look for a 4/6/8GB solution then.

The 970 is not a future proof card. If that is your goal you'd better look for a cheap 290 / 390 which both have possibly 8GB ram and better DX12 compat (search for Async Compute).

Can you wait? New graphiccards incoming within a few months... they likely won't push the speed barrier much at first (that comes next year) but are the freshest silicon you can get then. Fresh = best chances to survive long.

8 years ago*
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^this

8 years ago
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Search for any Nvidia Quadro if you plan design (don't go for gaming cards)

8 years ago
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Would suggest the same. The problem with the Quadro is, there are no good for gaming (I think).

8 years ago
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A bit sacrificable gaming, but still can handle it, and price can be reduced using AMD CPU covering Quadro GPU price

8 years ago
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Thank you, i already know about quadro. But i'm planing on rendering with cpu. And i want the graphic card for gamming.
Anyway, rightnow i have a laptop with a gt540m and it handle well with my 3d programs, so 970 will do it better.

8 years ago
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But i'm planing on rendering with cpu.

I cannot find words to describe how terrible of an idea that is, unless you are okay with leaving the PC running for weeks to render a scene and possibly killing your CPU with constant 100% utilization levels (they are designed to run 24/7 on 80%-85%).

8 years ago
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Now i'm using a i3-4160 with 8gb RAM and render times are about 8-12h. I hope with the I7 i can reduce time from 2-3h.
I render pictures of interior or exterior houses. Like this

The problem about GPU is, that quadro is very expensive. The one i can afford it is the k1200, that only have 4gb of VRAM, and 4gb is not enought for me in rendering.

8 years ago
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…but you are buying a 4 GB card nonetheless…

8 years ago
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but i will no render with it. This is why i said i want to render with CPU
If i try to render a scene that need 8gb RAM (when render with CPU) in a graphic card with 4GB the program will crash or give me an error an stop render.

8 years ago
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I can't help you with the techno-stuff, but here's a bump! Thanks for the giveaway.

8 years ago
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Bump!

8 years ago
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i know nothing about graphic cards but here have a bump.

8 years ago
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From what I've been recently told, the new amd card will be one to set a standard and is coming pretty soon, might want to look into what it promises

8 years ago
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Not for 3D work, those CUDA cores in Nvidia cards are a must.

8 years ago
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Yes, and nvidia have better support in 3d render programs.

8 years ago
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Yes, I'm waiting until june-july more or less. I want to see the new GPU's (AMD and Nvidia) and then choose the better option (970 or new amd or new nvida)

Thank you

8 years ago
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  1. There's no such thing as future proof in hardware but 970 is ideal for 1080p gaming so you should be fine for several years.
  2. The more RAM you have the better for rendering and 3D work.
8 years ago
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i will go with 16gb for start, and i will upgrade to 32 or 64 when i need it.
But i don't know about frecuency.

Thank you so much

8 years ago
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You should go with DDR4 @3000, more stability, for the graphic card the gtx970 will be good enough for 4 years, but in gaming, for rendering you should buy a quadro, why would you use the cpu for rendering? It takes a lot more time with the cpu and you stress it to much, hours of working with 100%

8 years ago
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I copy/paste for another comment: http://www.steamgifts.com/go/comment/7Sz9RgK

Now i'm using a i3-4160 with 8gb RAM and render times are about 8-12h. I hope with the I7 i can reduce time from 2-3h.
I render pictures of interior or exterior houses. Like this

The problem about GPU is, that quadro is very expensive. The one i can afford it is the k1200, that only have 4gb of VRAM, and 4gb is not enought for me in rendering.

In addition, i want to play games too.

8 years ago
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I you want an Nvidia card and you can wait a few months you can buy a Pascal card, it will be a great step forward over Maxwell architecture (GTX 970): http://wccftech.com/nvidia-pascal-gpu-analysis/

But if you can't wait that card is great anyway, I don't know if it will last 5 years but 2-3 at least to play with mid-high settings.

2x performance per watt estimated improvement over Maxwell.
To launch in 2016, purportedly the second half of the year.
DirectX 12 feature level 12_1 or higher.
Successor to the GM200 GPU found in the GTX Titan X and GTX 980 Ti.
Built on the 16nm FinFET manufacturing process from TSMC.
Allegedly has a total of 17 billion transistors, more than twice that of GM200.
Will feature four 4-Hi HBM2 stacks, for a total of 16GB of VRAM and 8-Hi stacks for up to 32GB for the professional compute SKUs.
Features a 4096-bit memory bus interface, same as AMD’s Fiji GPU power the Fury series.
Features NVLink (only compatible with next generation IBM PowerPC server processors)
Supports half precision FP16 compute at twice the rate of full precision FP32.

8 years ago*
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I'm waiting until june-july more or less. I want to see the new GPU's (AMD and Nvidia) and then choose.
THe thing is that theese new cards, won't have HBM, and maybe don't have gddr5x (based on rumors), so the increase in preformance will not be much.

So once they released, i will choose betwen a 970 or some new gpu.

Thanks for the answer.

8 years ago
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With the new cards probably there will be a price drop for the old ones. So even if you don't get a new one you could get a gtx970 cheaper or go for a gtx980.

8 years ago
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I don't know about the future GTX 970 equivalent/successor, but the GP100 flagship chip will have HBM2 memory for sure, take a look at the table I posted.

Maximum VRAM 32 GB HBM2

Anyway, the performance will be more related with the newer architecture with that increased number of transistors in 16nm rather than with the memory type.

8 years ago*
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The GP100 will be the GTX titan or the x80 ti.
The other ones will come with gddr5x or gddr5.( i read gddr5x manufacturing began recently and won't ready to sell massively until the end of the year).
Anyway, i will wait to see what the come and do a better choice.

8 years ago
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The new graphic cards from Nvidia will be presented at Computex, about amd i saw an article saying that we will have to wait till Q1 2017....

8 years ago
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I hope AMD show something in the computex too.

8 years ago
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I would take amd 390 Nitro than GTX970 mostly because you have 8GB not 3,5. Newest game need more and more ram. And second because there is very strange thing if we will check graphic test in many games (especially newest one). I don't know if this is because nvdia doing some strange thing with their driver/physx in games or amd is creating better drivers but in older games 390 and 970 have similar fps results in games but in new games for example The Division is very visible that 390 is getting better. This is magic OR nvdia is making 9xx card worse to prepare market for new generation

8 years ago*
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The problem about AMD is his energy consuption. This is enought for me to discard it. If the new generation solve this i will consider AMD.
The other thing is that Nvidia have better support in 3d programs.

Thanks for helping.

8 years ago
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"The problem about AMD is his energy consuption. "
Only for people for who several dolars more per year is so big amount of money that they will bankrupt......

To be frank this is so stupid excuse that is so often ditto that it can be changed into a joke/meme.
Older Geforce cards could have similar or more energy consumption and not many people bothered too much about it.

It's sad that often many people are taking geforce only because of that stupid thing with energy.

8 years ago*
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Energy consumption is important BUT its the idle consumption which is important. E.g. the power it draws when not running under full steam. e.g. desktop / browsing whatever power draw. 290/390 was OK with idle consumption, not perfect... but acceptable. Max power consumption is just important for the the dimension of your power rig.

8 years ago
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Sadly, the idle power needed for the higher-end AMDs is ridiculous and this lead to many brands rendered more or less useless with the R9 x90 cards since the fans are either loud as hell or the card can be cooked on.
Still, for OP's needs, I'd sooner get an R9 390X or Fury than a GTX 970…

8 years ago
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I'm just curious.
"R9 x90 cards since the fans are either loud as hell or the card can be cooked on."
Could you give me a link with test (It would be good if from two different sources) that would confirm what you wrote?
I always thought that this mostly depends from what company you bought (Gigabyte, MSI etc.). Different web pages give me different results about noise and temperatures.

For some times I have been thinking what graphic card I would buy and I ended up with reflections:

  • 970 it's not worth the price even more when we look at not fully 4GB ram (at least not worth in some country)
  • 390 many people complain about energy consumption
  • 960 2GB it's not too good idea and 4GB with Memory Bus Width 128 bit looks stupid
  • 380 again many people complain about energy consumption

If there would exist ... I don't know something like 960ti with price between 960 and 970 then I would buy it immediately but now it's hard to choose. Especially when you will compare geforce 770 or 780 with 960 or 970.

8 years ago*
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I was reading newegg user reviews, this is one of the best sources on a specific card. Gigabyte is abysmal, MSI is closely following in badness. ASUS too. XFX and Sapphire are decent, but they are HUGE because of their gigantic coolers.
Plus, well, the TDP is what, 270 W officially? I have to give NVidia something: at least their TDP is around 170-210 Watts, leading to much cooler cards. Sure, they are a cheating company that bribed SW manufacturers to use their piece of sabotaging code almost everywhere, and they overprice almost all of their products, not to mention that they are comfortably slow in any kind of innovation and are masters of re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-re-releasing the exact same product with slightly less restrictions removed, but at least they are more energy efficient.

Also: GTX 970 is worth the price. I only recommend one single Nvidia card currently over AMD, and that is the 970. It has the sickest current price/performance ratio, followed somewhat behind by the R9 380X (which almost reached god-tier ratio after its price drop).

8 years ago*
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I run the Sapphire R9 380 Dual X card - and when my case is open, I very rarely ever hear it - even under load.
I think the only time I've ever really noticed it is in Ark - Survival Evolved - When my case is closed, I don't hear it at all.
The model I'm running is about 330mm in length, but fits comfortably in a standard ATX case.
I have enough room to add another for XFire, but as I'm getting a new case this week (the new Coolermaster Ducasi Mid ATX), I should have enough room to Quad (when games get too nasty for 1 380 to handle).
I was originally upset about the 380 and it's performance wasn't what I was led to believe - Compared to NVidia's GTX 9XX range, IN DX11 NVidia cards ruled beyond comparason (IMHO), Then I upgraded to Windows 10 and tried some DX 12 benchmark tests - Now I wouldn't swap it for an NVidia SLI set no matter the model - Once more games start releasing with DX12, many gamers will be lamenting the purchase of an NVidia card - Unless they buy one of the new ones due for release in June/July, and even then there is no guarantee as NVidia's current architecture seems to have issues with DX12 Mantle.
I recall reading on PCGamer site that unless they completely redesign, they are going to be blown away in the coming round of AAA games. AMD cards have been looking forward and planning for DX12, while Nvidia has been coasting on it's rep - and that's about to pay off big time for AMD.

8 years ago
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The 380 and 380X are different though as they generate 40 or 60 Watts less heat, which is a lot easier to dissipate. This is one of the reasons I like to recommend the 380X now for those who cannot afford a GTX 970. It beats the 960 comfortably, has the same price range, and unless you buy a Gigabyte one, there is little concern for cooling.

8 years ago
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Yes, seems the continue having problems with Async compute.

8 years ago
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I have an 380 and its all fine. In idle it dosn't even need a fan and is about 27°C. On 100°C it goes up to ~75°C. That's totaly fine
I have a 450W PSU (Coolermaster) and no problem with super high energy consumption

8 years ago
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What 380 you have? x Nitro or what?

and what you mean by
"On 100°C it goes up to ~75°C"
? ? ? I don't get it.

I really like amd cards but It's hard to tell what card would you like more (380 vs 960 or 970 vs 390) when you can't check it by yourself.

8 years ago
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I have the Sapphire Radeon R9 380 Nitro.
And yeah, sorry I mean on 100% it goes up to ~75°C.

8 years ago
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With higher consuption, I will need a bigger PSU and need better cooling too. I will be running it for long time.
So the consuption is important for me. As i said if in the new generation solve, the solve this problem, i will consider to buy it.

8 years ago
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The question is. When we will get new generation and how it will be compared to the older one.

8 years ago
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I hope they give some clues in the computex.

8 years ago
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I can't understand most of the OP and answers, I can only offer you a bump.

8 years ago
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The 970 will be fine for mid/high settings op 1080p for the next few years. If it's going to be 4-5, nobody will know, but 2-3 will definitely be fine. You can run just about any game at ultra settings on 1080p with it right now.

I wouldn't go for the faster memory. It hardly makes any difference (at most 1-2fps), you can spend the money better on other parts.

If you don't mind having a slightly higher noise/power consumption, the AMD 390 is also a good card (a little faster and a little cheaper).

8 years ago
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Overclocking RAM hardly affects performance but greatly reduces stability. I really wouldn't do it.

The GTX 970 should do you fine for another 3-4 years at 1080p.

8 years ago
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970 is a great gpu especially for it's price. also you'll want an i7 cpu with hyperthreading.

8 years ago
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but not for the future.....i would not recommend this card now, if you want it use for couple of years

8 years ago
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If you are suggesting him to get a GTX 970 and pair it with an i7, you know nothing about bottlenecks.

8 years ago
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Stop pretending to be intelligent.

8 years ago
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You gotta be joking. Learn about computers first. I'm so annoyed with people pairing i7s with GTX 970 and getting 20% CPU load in everything.

8 years ago
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"You gotta be joking. Learn about computers first.". How ironic.

8 years ago
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Anyway, because I've had enough playing around with you, there are more things a CPU does than gaming. Like encoding videos for example. Kinda like OP asked for (I want to do OC to de processor to reduce render times), hence why I said get a i7 for hyperthreading. Next time you butt into to try and act like some elitist, stop, look in the mirror, realise who you are and how uneducated you are and stop typing. Good riddance.

8 years ago
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i7s are not as good as i5s for an OC because of the HT m8.

8 years ago
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if you disable the hyperthreading the i7 overclocks better. And I'm not your mate, don't make that mistake. You can admit you don't know as much as you thought you did any time now, I won't think any less of you, because that's not possible.

8 years ago
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I think upgrading from 2400 to 3000 in RAM isn't big deal in performance. I'd save some money there.

8 years ago
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RAM is almost never big deal, only you can see that in benchmarks....and it only affect integrated GPU if you want more FPS
already saw a few tests about it, and there will be more on the internet

8 years ago
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+1 That is just a waste of money,better spent on something else for what little gains you would get if any

8 years ago
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Not true when talking about DDR4. 2133MHz vs 3100MHz DDR4 makes A LOT of difference and it's even like 15 fps. Stop talking bullshit to people.

8 years ago
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Only if you use an APU and i don't think that OP will do that. In rendering and stuff you can't feel a big difference.

8 years ago
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Bump!

8 years ago
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I like your primary setup, not bad.
The CPU is sweet. (pretty much the successor of the one I'm still using :P
As long as you know for sure you need hyperthreading (which most don't need) then it's good.
I'd likely make slightly different choices about the cooler and psu, but your choices are not bad or anything.

With regards to your GPU choice. the 970 GTX is a good choice between raw power and budget for the time being but considering the current trend I don't believe it's as futureproof as I'd want it to be for its price. (As for raw power of course the 980 ti beats it by far).

The new architecture that's coming up soon should be a reasonable boost: Please do wait till they show consumer-ready models for that. Then you can make a much better choice.

If you really want a 970GTX: Personally I wouldn't go for the "Asus GeForce GTX 970 4GB STRIX" version but more towards the "MSI GeForce GTX 970 GAMING 4G", assuming there isn't a huge price difference where you live. Should be more efficient and with some overclocking on average get a bit more power out of it.

8 years ago*
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He wants to render. So he needs hyper-threading.
As for brands, the usual opinion is that for NVidia cards, you buy an EVGA one.

8 years ago
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Good point about hyperthreading: my experience with rendering is 0 :P.

To be fair I haven't seen EVGA as a usual opinion for nvidia cards around here. Might differ depending on where you usually look around/get opinions and info from.

8 years ago
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I don't know if i understand you wrong or you made a mistake. i7 6700k have hyperthreading.

Yes i will wait to see what's coming.

The msi now is like 15€ more expensive, but last week it was around 40€ (the asus increased his price).
Thank you for the tip.

8 years ago
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Yeah, i worded that the wrong way around. It does have hyperthreading and I was trying to suggest getting the i5-variant if you didn't need hyperthreading. But rereading my comment...I'm missing half the sentence and it's wrongly worded, sorry.
Since you need hyperthreading and it has it, that's all good.

8 years ago
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I would say middle to high settings you are ok for the next 4 years on 1080p. Just don't expect to go up to 60 fps though. That's what I usually do late in the graphic card's cycle, trade in resolution and AA for frames, or have constant 30 fps for sharper image.

8 years ago
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I'm going to say that no current GPU will be be good for 4-5 years based on 2 things:

1) Since consoles have finally come out of the dark ages, game graphics might become more demanding. Even if things pace the same, I think even a 980ti would be stretching it to maintain medium to high settings 4-5 years. I typically buy a GPU in the $350-$400 range and upgrade every 3 years to keep up. My last few graphics cards were a GTX 260, then I upgraded to a 470. The 470 was doing OK, and I probably could have gone another year with it but it crapped out after 2 years. It was under warranty, but I had to send it off and wait for a replacement. I still sent it off, but rather than wait I went ahead and bought a GTX 660 in a hurry for about $200 USD. That lasted me 2 years before I bout a GTX 970 last year to be able to run GTA V at 60fps on high settings (my CPU is a first gen i5 2.66GHz overclocked to 3.8GHz).

2) In 2-3 years 1080p is going to be out dated. We've already had of 1440p displays for a while and 4k displays coming down in price, so if you're doing 3D modelling, you'll probably be upgrading your display, and that's going to put extra strain on that GPU to push that resolution.

As for your RAM question, go with the RAM rated for the frequency you will be overclocking to. You can try overclocking the RAM, but RAM can be picky when overclocked. You'll have to mess with timings, and overclocking it might mean running it at slower timings to make it stable. RAM is pretty cheap, so get good RAM rated for the speed you will be running. For example, my first gen Core i5 2.66 GHz would use 1333MHz RAM, but I bought 1600MHz RAM because overclocking bumped up the RAM frequency. If your MB supports it, you can adjust the RAM speeds separate from the base clock. My MB supports this, but at the settings to give me 3.8GHz, brought the RAM frequency up to 1600MHz with options to run at lower frequencies of 1200MHz or 1400MHz. I could have bought cheaper 1333MHz RAM and run it underclocked at 1200MHz or tried pushing it to 1400MHz, but it was easier just to get 1600MHz RAM and not worry about it.

8 years ago*
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1080p is going to be here for some time until 1440p gaming becomes cheaper.When 1440p gaming cards get priced around 150-200 U.S. until then 1080p will be the standard most will aim for.

Over clocking ram is not worth it and should only be done if you know what your doing and risk the hardware for small gains.

You can not future proof no matter want anyone suggest there is no way to tell what it will hold,a year from now there could be a huge break through and push hardware to new heights.It could stay stagnant like it is now and we see small gains and so far the biggest gains we are getting is in power consumption over raw power.Heat is becoming the issue its not really a question of getting more powerful but how to due it and keep things from getting to hot.

Also more things are being shifted to using more ram and such because of consoles and most games being a port.Games are easier to port when you can use more ram like the consoles have then it is to to optimize it to work on less ram.Consoles also rely more on CPU then GPU and why some newer releases rely more heavy on the CPU.As we move forward i think more then 4 cores will be a bigger issue then the GPU itself.As even the old AMD 7850 is about how powerful a current consoles .Consoles make up for it with the CPU being 8 core to pick up some of the slack and the added ram.

My 7950 still servers as a very solid 1080p card and it is what about 4-5 year old tech?I do think AMD 390 would be the better choice for the extra VRAM if they main focus is gaming but also use it for rendering.It may not be the best choice for rendering but if there main goal is gaming then these will do just fine.

Now if this rendering is more then a hobby and say for a business then maybe they should think of one built for rendering and give up some gaming for better production time.As they say time is money.

8 years ago*
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I think 1080p is on its last legs for being mainstream. It will hang around a while, kicking and screaming until it dies though. I bought a 7" tablet during xmas for $125 that has higher res than 1080p. Tablets and high end notebooks have moved to high res, high DPI displays already, and desktops will start catching up. It's been available to desktops for years now, it just hasn't seen wide scale adoption. If he's going to be doing 3D modeling, he should be using a large display or multiple displays, and I personally wouldn't run 1080p on anything larger than a 24" display.

8 years ago
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You solve my doubs about RAM. But know i have another one,
How can i know the frequency i will need the ram when i do the overclok before to buy it?
Maybe i take the 3000MHz and then set it to the needed.
Thank you.

8 years ago
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bump

8 years ago
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IMHO get better PSU for your RIG :D

8 years ago
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  1. No. Depending on how terrible it will utilise DX12, its life expectancy currently is around 3 years. If you want a card that lives for 4-5 years, you probably need an AMD R9 390X or Fury, and a really well-ventilated case for the heat they generate.
    Or, even better, get a Quadro or FirePro. Both are good now in gaming – the FirePro is a little better, but there aren't really much difference between them in this regard, and the Quadro line usually outclasses AMD in rendering. not to mention that it outclasses GeForce A LOT in rendering.

  2. The opposite: the closer the memory stick's frequency is to the specification base (2133 MHz in DDR4), the more stable the system will be.
    Still, in general, currently 2666 MHz sticks are stable as hell, and there are even a few really good ones up to 3200 MHz (but they also cost almost double of a good 2133 MHz stick).
    Also, unless the latency is also great, having a 3 GHz+ memory stick won't bring any real improvement over a cheap one. I have to add though that you are right in the sense that if RAM helps anywhere, it is usually compressing, which is an important part of media handling.

Edit: Two other things
You want to render but only have 1 TB of storage space for it? This doesn't seem right.
And for the money you spend on that liquid cooler, you could get an air cooler with better performance. Liquid cooling under 90-100 Euros only has one single advantage over air cooling, it is easier to fit in a small case.

8 years ago*
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About quadro, i answer you in other coment.

About storage, I have a library of 3TB right now. And i have about 6TB of storage, so i think i don't need more.

About cooling, is not definitelly, but i consider a Noctua NH-D15 and a Phanteks PH-TC14PE. I decide for AIO water cooling and improve it in a custom later (and utilize its radiator).

8 years ago
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As I know, for this kind of work you not need some powerful gaming videocards - just new low-end or medium class, with low power consumption and quiet cooling system. But main priority - memory size, bigger is better, more size > GDDR speed.

8 years ago
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THe gaming videocard is why i want gamming too.
Yes i will get 16gb first and upgrade when needed to 32 or 64gb.

8 years ago
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I mean VIDEOmemory.) As I know 3D modelling and rendering requares alot of videomemory.)

8 years ago
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If ou render with GPU yes. But i cand afford one for that.
Thanks for the explanation

8 years ago
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bump

8 years ago
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If you want to run games in middle-high setting at 1080P for the next 4-5 years at acceptable framerates then get used to the idea of changing your GPU at least once.
Games have cerrtainly got more hardware-hungry.
You can always sell your 970 for an acceptable price and get the next mid-higher range GPU in a few years time.

Edit: Of course it depends on what kind of games you play.

8 years ago
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twice *

8 years ago
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MSI GeForce GTX 970 Gaming Edition OR MSI - AMD Radeon R9 380 4GB GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 Graphics Card - Black

^ Check those out. THey'll last around 4 years till they start slowing down but they overclock like a beast.

8 years ago
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Closed 8 years ago by jmif.