wow - i guess i was going into wrong groups o.O didn't notice that all of SG groups are 2-3 people o.O
other thing - yeah - I prefer to give my games to someone I know, chat with, got something from etc, than a random who doesn't even care to say "thanks" like most entrants into public GAs.
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People who give away regular games will keep giving them away. People who give away bundled games will stop. In reality, we're not losing much. If you want the game, instead of entering a giveaway you can just spend $1 and get it yourself. No harm done.
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It's more efficient to actually buy them than to enter giveaways for them.
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Inb4 more threads like this: "WHY MY CONTRIB VALUE NOT INCREASE!!111 HALP"
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You should see the support tickets.
Contributor value
There was an error and you drop my value my mistake
Why did my contributor amount suddenly drop?
Contribution value dropped down
Decreased total value. Why?
Humble Weekly now counts as a bundle?
Value
My contributor amount does not seem to reflect the total thats has been contributed.
mi contribucion, se ha rebajado 30,00$ ... porque ??
etc etc
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I love the one in Spanish. I'm starting to write my tickets in that language.
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Do you have someone to translate those tickets in other languages for you?
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Might wanna find some volunteers to help you out with those, I know Google personally and he can be a bit thick sometimes.
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Must have been a pain in the ass to deal with these idiots.
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Must have been a pain in the ass to deal with these idiots.
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I highly doubt EVERY game will be on HumbleBundle and indiegala. If I ever see EA allow them to giveaway steam keys for $1 minimum to KoA + All DLC's, Mass Effect 3 + All DLC's, Sim City, etc. etc. I'd probably have to have sex with Compass <3
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What i meant was that sure it's abusing the system but the system is built for abuse, i mean the sole fact that you get contribution value based on how much it's worth on steam coupled with frequents giveaways from cg with 1000+ CV... It's like begging people to search for this kind of opportunities. Don't get me wrong i find it sad but i can't blame people for doing it.
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This was a good move :) And yes, I've given away bundle games but only because bundles usually have a game or two I already own (or don't want to play) so I might as well gift the extra copies to someone who does. Farming CV ruins the original idea of contributor system which forces community to break into smaller pieces with all the private groups. In the end the ones who lose are those who would benefit the most from free games: people who enjoy gaming but cannot afford it :)
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I think this is good, BUT I do not agree with last week's bundle being added to the list. I'm sure many people would not have bought it if it was on the bundle list and since it was stated at the time that they weren't going to count as bundle games, it's kind of a slap in the face to now make it a bundle retroactively. I'm not saying this is a bad move going forward, just that the first bundle shouldn't be added to the list, only moving forward.
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"However, the reason I haven't added this bundle to the list is then I'd have to add all the indiegala bundles (like Crazy Machines) and then I'd have to add all the Amazon bundles and then we might as well just remove contrib because the bundle list will be larger than the non-bundled list."
If these are added, gala store will be added, Amazon will be added, contrib will be removed. This sentence clearly implies that it will not be added. We are not lawyers on sg. You do not have to explicitly say something for what you said to mean something.
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I suggested this multiple times, but it probably won't hurt do it one more time: the issue you're raising could be solved by adding all $1/non-bta stuff to the bundle list, while at the same time removing bta (and even Indie Royale) form the said list.
90% of the people who try to game the CV system buy the $1 version anyway, and if you bough Darksiders 2 for $7 I see no reason why it would be bundled.
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My guess? You were one of the people who bought many as a CV bump.
The entire Bundle List was a retroactive teeth kick to everyone, but most just accepted it. There was no 'fairer' way to prevent abuse of bundles on the system.
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If by "many" you mean "one", then sure. :rolleyes:
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There are other ways that would arguably more fair.
The bundle list system just happens to be Steamgifts' method. One that has become shakier with the increase in bundles, the grey area and contention of sales, and the issues that have grown over time (like the occasional game that was in a bundle increasingly long ago and has not been in a bundle since).
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It is fair, but IMO not fair for people who already gave away some of these games (yes, I include myself on that list). We all know contributor value has never been real, due to sales, trading, etc. But i think you cant just 'take it' out from someone. It's like when there is a price drop, you cant lower the contributor value of users who gave away that game. (I dont know if that happens on price drops, if it doesnt, then i think that this case should be like that one)
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They do reduce the CV when the official Steam price drops, which IMO is completely idiotic.
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"They' do not, they system automatically takes prices from the US Steam store. When they change, the value on SG changes. You do realize how this setup is superior to the mods manually changing values for every game on Steam that gets its price changed, right?
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You're not serious! Do you know how much we're paying those lazy procrastinating pricks to read tons of abuse and deal with thousands of tickets? They should find the time to manually enter prices into the database! :)
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Lots? I know a guy who knows a guy who was with DonVino taking pictures as he was handing you rolls of hundred dollar bills. Also, I has looked at his profil (I really haven't, I was lazy). o/
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I guess you've never worked with databases before, eh? One could easily store the value of a game when its given away. The game itself is already being stored in a database, so why can't a field be added for value/price? Calculating it based on current prices is, like I said, idiotic.
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but the people who bought it at a discount will gain the same amount of contrib value as those who bought it at full price :o or they will wait until the sale passes to make it appear they bought it at sale price D:
Do you see where I'm going with this? More work, same effect.
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You clearly don't understand. The system as it stands now already grants you the list price, not the sale price. Nobody has ever said that should change.
At the time of a giveaway, the system can take the Steam list price (not sale price) and add it to the database so it's tracked and counted forever. I managed a SQL database at my previous job for three years, it's really not that difficult to track those types of things.
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Of course this will upset many people. You either put them as bundle from the begin or not. People saw they were not treated as bundle games, and some decided to throw a lot of money into this, hoping to improve their contributor value. Some of them might have even wasted far more money than they usually could, just so they could take profit in this, and at some point, you can just decide to change it, just because you want to? Besides being highly stupid and showing complete and utter disregard for your users, it seems to me as taking advantage of your status to just change things however you want. Of course people are mad, and the flame will start even worse once more people realize they've spent large amounts of money for nothing... Not all of us have the financial status to be able to donate that much, and the chance we had for this was golden. Thank you, SteamGifts staff for showing how much you don't care about your lower class users. I now expect my account to be deleted for this comment, but I don't care, I'll just use a different site similar, where we aren't treated like this.
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Giving away games is not an investment. Period.
Also this is a private site, I guess if you don't like the way it's run you can go elsewhere. Or do you go to McDonalds and ask for Whoopers?
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I did not agree, but I did not expect it to be changed nor I whined about it in the forums as particularly people hoarding copies of games to boost their CV does not concern me at all. :)
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Not the point, bro. You said, if you don't like the way it's ran then you can go elsewhere. You didn't do that when you didn't agree, why tell someone else to? Did you tell the people, who complained to the mods to make these into bundles, to leave too? Probably not.
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I disagreed with the former policy. One can express disagreement, other thing is blatantly insulting an whining.
And the mods take their own decisions.
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I don't care too much about CV, but I did have multiple copies from Amazon for all of the games from the last weekly humble bundle. Now if I give them away, I look like a contrib exploiter :/
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^^This
An investment gone wrong on a site purposely put up for gifting games to random strangers? Someone really took Adam Smith far too serious. It also doesn't sound healthy at all...
Also the Whopper is probably whooping large, but whooping? ;-)
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Maybe you should stop looking at gifting games as something to "profit" from...
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Relevant
Contributor giveaways are something that was instituted to give people the option of rewarding people who were already contributing to the SteamGifts community in the first place. They were not intended to be something that would cause people to try and abuse the system by inflating their contribution value. That's why measures were taken and continue to be taken to prevent the worst forms of this abuse. Most of you probably already know all this.
What really makes no sense, though, is how people are still trying, and how much so many people obsess over their precious 'value.' Honestly, if you're just trying to get your value up to enter contributor giveaways, leave. Just stop. Grab your things and go. This is not the place for you. Contributor giveaways aren't even that exclusive unless you get a ridiculously high value. You're better off just saving your money and buying the games you want if you're only trying to raise your value for selfish reasons.
tl;dr: Stop wasting your time and money worrying about your value. If you think it's a good investment, you're an idiot.
Edit: For those of you who don't understand the reasons behind this post, it's mostly in response to how many people I see whining about issues with their contributor value who obviously would never make giveaways at all except to try and raise it. As stated previously, take it somewhere else. This is not an investment or a trade-off. Stop expecting to get something in return for your contributions, warm fuzzies aside.
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I, for one, don't think your account is going to be deleted. Steamgifts has consistently demonstrated that it's a very tolerant community. Even more so than it should be at times. I understand your frustration, but I don't feel it's justified. You must have thought that what you were doing was "gaming the system". We're a flexible bunch, and I'm sure that weekly bundles might have stayed out of the bundle list if they hadn't flooded the site to that extent. Personally, I think they should have been in there from the get go.
If you'd like a suggestion, just do giveaways for things you like to give away. If you're doing it for the contribution value, you're bound to get upset at some point, and it's simply not worth it.
If you still feel you need to leave SG, best of luck wherever you go.
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It's not the fact that there are bundle games that do not give contributor value that bothers me, it is the fact that they can just decide to change something from non-bundle to bundle whenever they want.
I accept the idea of bundle games giving only 30$max contributor, but put it from the very begin as bundle or not, don't change your mind and affect a large number of users just because the staff decided to change their minds over night. That is the part that I find unacceptable.
While some users do indeed have the resources to donate 500$, 1000$ or even more, there is still a large number of us poor folk around. The best games are always given with a contributor value far larger than our possibility, and we are left with the weakest of games to fight 2.000+ entries for one copy. I bought a lot of those THQ bundles both to help myself, with the contributor value, and I do admit that, but also because it was a chance to give to my friends and even to random people some good games. I decided that moment because it was fortuitous from multiple points of view: the games were great, and I got something in return. I am a poor person, but I found this particular moment good enough to be worth an investment that was actually very costly for me, and after finally achieving something, I realize I lost half of the good side of the giveaway? Of course people will be mad about this, we are not all rich enough to afford this. If they would have just put it bundle game from the begin, nobody would have commented. The simple fact that they can change their minds like this is what will start the flame
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Bundle games are inevitably marked as such AFTER the fact, since SG has no way of knowing them before they're released as a bundle. It's always taken some time, and it's always happened retroactively from the day the bundle came out.
Again, I think that it was initially the feeling of the community that weekly sales could have stayed out of the list, but that soon changed when they flooded the site. In that sense, you kinda rushed to the decision to raise your contributor, which is not a good way to pick your giveaways.
Long story short, you gambled a relatively small deposit for big contributor earnings. Some gambles pay off. Some don't. It's really valuable lesson at such small cost, considering.
I fear I may be repeating myself, but to my mind it's the right decision.
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The phrase, "The exception proves the rule," comes from an archaic usage of the word proof, when it meant 'test.' The actual meaning of the saying is that exceptions put the rule to the test to see if it's actually even a rule at all, but ignorant people now quote it trying to say that an exception is somehow evidence of the validity of a rule, which is just plain stupid.
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I didn't even pay attention to what was being discussed. I just get annoyed at people who misuse common sayings and the like. Your argument is specious, however. Picking up games in a normal Steam sale to give away is as different from expecting to get 3-digit value out of your single-digit layout as night and day. I can't believe people still try to use this obviously weak line of reasoning. It just makes them look like they don't understand basic arithmetic.
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Sorry if I make you annoyed.
I'm just trying to say that all CV system is not perfect at all and many users makes GA only because they can get good cheap game.
Of course there is much difference between buying $50 priced game for $25 and for $1. But isn't it better just to let everyone gift bundled games (not free ones like Dota 2, of course) for constant 5% of their full value to CV? Bundled game is still a game. And in this way there will be not much "one digit cost three digit CV". I'm sure that there is not much games that drops their price by 95% even in bundles.
You may say that rising CV is not ideological goal, but it makes nothing with human's (especially kid's) psychology. So, IMHO, it's better when users gives away 100 bundled games than 10 sale games.
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Oh, I'll be the first to admit the contributor system is deeply flawed. What bothers me the most about it is the sort of behavior it fosters. Over the last several months since it was implemented, I've seen it open a rift in this community and turn something I love into something I hate. I don't think any amount of tinkering can fix that. I want it gone completely. And don't worry about the annoyance. We all have our pet peeves.
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Actually I think I bought a 0.33 because of a sale and I had 40 cents on a prepaid cc.
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The problem with your statement is that in this case, the person in charge of the bundle list said that the games would not be added on the list. Other bundles, people know the games will be added.
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Granted you have internet acess 200 hundred games on your Steam account and a machine to play them you are not poor.
A person is poor when he lives with less than 1,25$ a month. I don't see you fitting there.
And also I'm not rich and I still contribute. FYI I live mostly on my scolarship and I spend the whole summer working so that I have cash to spare during the year. ;)
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I liked "the chance we had for this was golden" part :D
that's the beauty of internet, you just don't have to be an anonymous abuser anymore, you can also show it!
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Large amounts of money 'for nothing'..Nope, not like we're here to give out of the goodness of our heart. No siree. Fuck dem people, i want my free games and i want to spend a dollar to get a 60$ one. The fact i have to be kind to other human beings is just an unwanted side effect.
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If you decide to invest A LOT OF MONEY (still don't see that - buying 2-3 bundles for 3$ totally is no way investing a lot) trying to cheat/exploit system and get unfair advantage over other ppl you have to take possibility that it will be revoked. Simple as that.
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Sounds reasonable enough. I think that people must have thought it was coming anyway. Hopefully we won't see many qq's in the next few days.
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I'm starting to wonder why everyone who disagrees with the action is affected by it.
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What is your corcern then? And I'm not going to deflect arguments anymore.
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I have four specific concerns, and for the record, I use this site to give away games I wind up with that I don't want and will continue to do so regardless of what is considered a bundle and what is not. Here's what I see:
To summarize: I would probably be fine with this decision had it only applied to "Weekly Sales" added after the announcement was posted, or if it had been made immediately upon the bundle's release. It still wouldn't be perfect, but the system is far from perfect and isn't perfectable for reasons I'm sure have been discussed before.
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I do agree that the decision has took too long to be made. And "ideally" giveaways should not decrease with those games being added to the bundle list.
Rectroativeness is usually only done from the start of the bundle, which generally means it will have passed like a day or two at the most, this is the most radical change on CV I've seen in my time here. And as I've said I do understand why people might feel cheated, but after all they've gambled and the've lost.
What makes a bundle is not really clear. Anything featured on the mayor bundles is. Also I think that what has triggered this to be considered as a bundle is the blatant abuse being done by some users.
Also CV dropping (as a result of price dropping) is more like an issue on how the site is coded than an actual policy.
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Tell me where someone said that those games were never going to be added to the bundle list. Please.
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Shobo is not staff, he's only in charge of the bundle list
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I disagree with it as well. I agree they should be on the bundle list, but they should have been put on the list from the start. They can't retroactively add everything when they said the games would not be added.
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I would have preferred this to be a rule going forward. Im sure some people did spend hard earned money buying several of those and the feeling they had was darksiders wasnt changed so this wont be either. I did personally give away some of them within a few groups. But hell I've lost lots of contrib value of things I owned before bundles launched so it is what it is. But I didnt with the darksiders since I assumed that would be the case. Now the rules change after the fact. Much better to change rules going forward not after people have spent money.
Now With all that being said I do agree with it and hence why I never bought any of the darksiders stuff. I expected it. But to my knowledge there was no warning of this so IMO its pretty shady to just change it retroactively. Sp I decided to give away. But at least this sets the president now that this can happen. So I'll be more careful in the future. Ive already lost several undred contrib value int he past giving a gift of something away form my inventory right before it went live in a bundle. I really wish there was a way to specify if its a gift in inventory.
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After deliberation among the staff and listening to community feedback, these have been added to the bundle list and will continue to be added as appropriate. There really isn't much difference between the "Weekly Sale" and a regular featured bundle, other than the duration (one week vs two) and the name.
Last week, when they decided not to add the bundle, it wasn't yet known what the future Humble Weekly Sales would look like. But having seen the new one this week, it was clear that these promotions are best treated like any other bundle.
As always, contribution values for bundle games are calculated based on the time they were available in a bundle. That means that even if a bundle that came out last week is added today, the giveaways between the start of that bundle and today will lose their value when the games are added in the list. This is sure to upset many people, but this rule has been in place ever since the bundle list was introduced and hasn't changed.
For more detailed information about the bundle list and how contribution values are calculated, see this thread.
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